ntsc-rs crashes my computer.

[Oweblow1]

This has happened twice now: I'm just using ntsc-rs, then my computer monitor stops displaying a signal from my GPU, my keyboard and mouse's lights turn off (Razer Blackwidow v3 and Deathadder v2) and my PC is completely unreponsive, I can't even hold the power button to power it off, I have to turn it off by the power supply which is incredibly risky. Please fix this: this is a realistic VHS effect and I don't want to have to stop using it so I don't end up frying my PC.

[0x5066]

It's not an ntsc-rs issue and more so with your hardware, more than likely. I'd check if the same happens with other intensive applications, or bring your computer to a shop, if feasible.

[Degamisu]

it could be age, I had it happen to my computer before. Depending on the age of your PC, it wears down and crashes after a while. Just to be safe if its old, backup all your files. I lost a lot of stuff when my PC died. (some recovered though)

[valadaptive]

As mentioned above, this is likely a hardware issue. The only software capable of crashing your computer like that is a driver, which ntsc-rs is definitely not.

There are a variety of hardware issues which could cause this.

Your CPU may be overheating (you can check with Core Temp; ntsc-rs makes use of all CPU cores, so it can be quite intensive on high-resolution videos.

It could also be a dying GPU--the user interface is GPU-accelerated, and moves a lot of data onto the GPU during video playback. This sounds like the most likely culprit to me. You can try running some GPU-intensive games and see if you get similar crashes.

[Oweblow1]

My computer's hardware is an AMD Radeon RX 6700 XT and an AMD Ryzen 5900x (other hardware included obviously but isn't important here). The computer itself (considering upgrades overtime) is technically 5 months old. The idea that it happens when my PC experiences intense usage is wrong, as (here is an example) I have played GTA V before at just over default settings at 90-180 FPS without it crashing. To be fair, there is a driver update to my AMD Adrenalin software from 24.2.1 to 24.4.1. Do you happen to know any applications that can conflict with ntsc-rs?

[Oweblow1]

And also, even with the driver update, it crashed my PC again so from the looks of things, it's an issue with your software.

[0x5066]

If it's an issue with the software, how do you suggest to fix it? Check power delivery with a kill-a-watt or similar, I just don't believe it's the software itself (or else you'd have hundreds of reports about this). If anything you could also check Event Viewer

[valadaptive]

Userspace software cannot crash your computer by itself. If it could, that would be a massive security vulnerability. Try running a Blender benchmark or something else to stress your CPU? Or Memtest86+ to test your RAM?

There may also be some issues with third-party drivers for other hardware. I once installed a driver for a drawing tablet that caused random crashes until I flat-out deleted it because the uninstaller didn't work.

[Oweblow1]

If it was an issue, I'd check for ways to fix hardware support issues if you have any. Any, looking at Event Viewer, it gave "Kernel-Power" errors saying my PC rebooted without shutting down, weirdly, it's even before I started having issues with your software. 🤔 Look, I'm gonna do the stress test thing to check further.

[0x5066]

"weirdly, it's even before I started having issues with your software." Am leaning towards the PSU being faulty for one reason or other, but do run these tests.

[Oweblow1]

Yeah, I'm going to run the Blender Benchmark. By the way, what I meant by the issues is the errors (they date to before I started using the software).

[Oweblow1]

These are the results of the Blender benchmark.

The only thing of some interest that occured during testing is when it was testing the CPU; the cursor started to lag a bit, but I don't consider it an anomaly because the Blender benchmark was literally using 100% of my CPU, of course that's probably going to happen.

Anyway, I didn't use memtest86+ as it asked to be installed to a flash drive, and the only flash drive I own is inside my Wii U.

Also, ever since I've stopped using ntsc-rs (after 8 May 2024), there has been no Kernel-Power errors in Event Viewer which increases my belief that it may be your software that is the issue, I'm sorry.

[0x5066]

...because the Blender benchmark was literally using 100% of my CPU...

err, do you have any GPU based benchmarks? The only one I know of that is free is https://benchmark.unigine.com/valley

[Oweblow1]

I know of one called Unigine Heaven, I'm gonna test Unigine Valley and that.

[Oweblow1]

I did both benchmarks at the highest settings (Extreme and Extreme HD for Unigine Valley), and sorry to say amigo but it appears to be your software. My PC didn't break a sweat in both of these benchmarks for the most part (at default clockspeed), it only got 70 degrees celsius hot because y'know: intense rendering. Look I'm sorry, ok?

[Oweblow1]

If it was a problem relating to the power supply, I would've found out in both benchmarks as it would've probably had some pretty bad issue doing it. Look man, I'm sorry to burst your bubble, ok?

[valadaptive]

I fully believe that ntsc-rs is triggering the bug, but it is not a bug in ntsc-rs itself. This is because the OS is designed not to allow individual applications to crash it. If an application can find a way to crash the OS, it's a very big security vulnerability, and Microsoft will pay you a lot of money for finding it.

It's like if I went to lean against the side of a building, and the entire thing collapsed. Yes, the building's collapse was caused by me leaning on it, but buildings shouldn't do that.

Back in the olden days, the operating system ran on the same level as all the applications, and they were all expected to play nicely with each other. If one application crashed, it would bring down the whole system.

Nowadays, all operating systems run at a lower level than the applications do, which isolates badly-behaving applications from one another. If an app is using 100% CPU, the OS will simply say "sorry, it's not your turn with the CPU anymore" and give the next application time to run. If an app freezes in Windows, it'll just say "this application is not responding" rather than your entire computer not responding.

The only software that runs on the same level as the OS is device drivers, which may be causing the issue.

Another possibility is an issue with the CPU--some people have reported issues with the Ryzen 5900X:

• Ryzen 5900x: System constantly crashing/restarting WHEA-Logger ID 18 and critical error Kernel-Power
• AMD Ryzen 9 5900X mce Hardware Error
• My PC crashes since I upgraded to a Ryzen 9 5900x

You could try disabling PBO (CPU overclock), D.O.C.P./XMP (RAM overclock), and/or upgrading your BIOS.

[Oweblow1]

Actually, I've never overclocked the CPU or RAM, and way before I started experiencing issues, I flashed my BIOS to the latest version.

[Oweblow1]

Also, it's not as if my PC was frozen, my mouse just started to lag (like from 180 fps to 20-40 fps).

[valadaptive]

PBO and D.O.C.P may be enabled by default.

Also, it's not as if my PC was frozen, my mouse just started to lag (like from 180 fps to 20-40 fps).

Wait, your mouse lags when doing what exactly?

[Oweblow1]

The Blender benchmark.

[Oweblow1]

In CPU mode.

[Degamisu]

The Blender benchmark.

What version of blender are you using for the benchmark?

[0x5066]

We're not really getting anywhere...

PBO and D.O.C.P may be enabled by default.

This should be investigated, though

[Oweblow1]

@Degamisu Blender 4.0.

[Degamisu]

@Degamisu Blender 4.0.

Alright. Ill look into that, can you send a video of your computer crashing? i could diagnose the problem from there. thanks @Oweblow1 !

[Oweblow1]

I don't want to use ntsc-rs again to crash my PC because well... do I even have to explain the riskiness of doing that?

[Oweblow1]

However, I can say this guy was having exactly the same issue (same thing happened). https://github.com/valadaptive/ntsc-rs/issues/48

[valadaptive]

However, I can say this guy was having exactly the same issue (same thing happened). #48

As I mentioned in that other issue, an application crash that happens predictably (when the render button is pressed) is different from an OS crash that happens randomly. Not all crashes are the same.

As I have mentioned many times, an application that isn't a driver and doesn't even ask for admin permissions cannot crash the OS on its own. There must, by definition, be a bug in the OS or a hardware issue, because one of the OS's core responsibilities is to prevent applications from crashing your entire computer.

[Oweblow1]

In that case, your program is starting to sound like an undetected virus that somehow silently got admin permissions.

[Oweblow1]

Or who knows, maybe Windows 11 is actually that bad.

[valadaptive]

In that case, your program is starting to sound like an undetected virus that somehow silently got admin permissions.

If I knew how to bypass the UAC prompt and obtain enough permissions to crash the OS, I would have a lot of bug bounty money from Microsoft.

Seeing as many people have used this very same software on Windows and I haven't received any other reports of OS crashes, I really do not see any other possibility than something being wrong with your computer.

Try the following, and see if they make any difference:

• Reboot into safe mode and try running ntsc-rs there, to rule out potential driver issues.
• Ensure that Precision Boost Overdrive is Disabled in your BIOS.
• Ensure that EXPO/XMP is Disabled in your BIOS and that your RAM is running at 2133MHz. (the 5900X uses DDR4, right?)

[Degamisu]

Or who knows, maybe Windows 11 is actually that bad.

No. Windows 11 is supported and tested.

In that case, your program is starting to sound like an undetected virus that somehow silently got admin permissions.

This is mostlikely the case. is your antivirus avira by any chance?

[Oweblow1]

No, it's Malwarebytes, and besides, I scanned the app file with VirusTotal.

[Oweblow1]

@valadaptive There's no PBO support in my BIOS I believe, I'll check the rest.

[valadaptive]

@Degamisu is not affiliated with this project in any way. I think she may have had some issues with Avira in the past, and/or is suggesting that some other virus might be causing the problem. I don't personally think that's likely.

[Oweblow1]

Ok, thing is, I've scanned my PC with Malwarebytes and there is no malware so you're right.

[Oweblow1]

WAIT, I've found PBO, I disabled it, now let me try the software to see if there's any problems.

[Oweblow1]

@valadaptive Oh my god, thank you so much! I'm so sorry for ever doubting you! Turns out PBO just had to be disabled!

[Oweblow1]

Oh wait, it crashed again, nevermind.

[Oweblow1]

Went into Safe Mode: ntsc-rs didn't even launch (kept getting this error saying ctrmon.exe overflow). Went into the BIOS: XMP didn't seem to be enabled as the RAM was running at it's default clockspeed (DDR4-2666).

I think you might be right in saying it might be a driver issue, I'll reinstall my graphics card driver to make sure.

[Oweblow1]

I reinstalled the driver, I've also disabled fast startup (because it's known to cause the Kernel-Power error), time to test it.

[Oweblow1]

I've rendered 10 videos as a test to make sure it doesn't end up crashing, and no problems have occured. Thank you so much @valadaptive and again, sorry for ever doubting you.

[Degamisu]

@Degamisu is not affiliated with this project in any way. I think she may have had some issues with Avira in the past, and/or is suggesting that some other virus might be causing the problem. I don't personally think that's likely.

Yes, Avira has fried one of my computers, the symptoms @Oweblow1 was reminding me of the symptoms (, which could get more serious if it were the case.

anyways, glad the issue is fixed!

[Oweblow1]

@Degamisu I wouldn't really trust Avira, if you ever need anti-malware, use Malwarebytes to scan your PC (only let it run when you want to do a system scan to stop the pop-ups) and use VirusTotal to scan downloaded files off the internet.

[Degamisu]

@Degamisu I wouldn't really trust Avira, if you ever need anti-malware, use Malwarebytes to scan your PC (only let it run when you want to do a system scan to stop the pop-ups) and use VirusTotal to scan downloaded files off the internet.

Thanks! I use a combination of Avast and my own custom antivirus. Thanks for the suggestion though!

[Oweblow1]

Wait, custom antivirus?

[Oweblow1]

@valadaptive It happened again.

[Degamisu]

@valadaptive It happened again.

now that its fresh in your mind, was there any bluescreen? i might know the issue

[0x5066]

If a Bluescreen occurred, this will be useful: https://www.nirsoft.net/utils/blue_screen_view.html

[valadaptive]

If disabling PBO decreases the crash rate, it's possible that something's wrong with your CPU or RAM. I know you already ran the Blender benchmark, but try Prime95 or purchase a USB drive and try memtest86.