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Indicate more clearly when the beginning of a psalm should be skipped #70

Closed GoogleCodeExporter closed 9 years ago

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Preamble:

When the antiphon is the same as the beginning of the psalm, the part identical 
to the antiphon is to be skipped. Currently, the program detects this and 
places a double dagger symbol after the text to be skipped. This is useful, but 
requires the user to look somewhere other than where he is reading.

Three users have ased me for a clearer indication of this, and I have also 
personally noted the need.

Printed breviaries usually have a dagger at the end of the antiphon and another 
dagger at the point to which the reader should skip. I told that some older 
breviaries use a double dagger. The double dagger is a good choice for 
divinum-officium because a single dagger could be mistaken for an indication to 
make the sign of the cross, since other cross symbols are inserted in the text 
for this reason.

Important correction:

I think the best solution would be to imitate the typography of printed 
breviaries by placing a (double) dagger after the antiphon and another at the 
point to which the user should skip. Placing the dagger after the antiphon 
could be mildly complicated, since I believe the fact that a dagger needs to be 
placed is currently recognized when the psalm is output, after the antiphon has 
already been printed. A less desirable but adequate alternative would be to put 
a dagger at the beginning of the psalm, so that the user doesn't have to search 
ahead to see that he needs to skip. Other alternatives would be to eliminate 
the use of daggers and demarcate the text in another manner: put it in red 
parentheses, use a smaller font, etc.

Minor correction:

The dagger indicating the point to which the reader should skip is almost where 
it should be, but would be better placed at the beginning of what the user 
should read rather than at the end of what he shouldn't read. Thus, when the 
antiphon matches half a verse, the dagger should come after the asterisk 
instead of before it. When it matches the whole first verse, the dagger should 
come at the beginning of the second verse instead of the end of the first.

Today's matins (11-10-2011) may be a convenient test case: antiphon 4 matches 
the first half-verse; antiphon 7 matches the whole first verse.

Original issue reported on code.google.com by a...@liturgiaetmusica.com on 10 Nov 2011 at 4:46

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
The "best solution" is quite doable, and I agree in preferring it.  On the 
whole I'd like to follow printed breviary typography wherever possible.  
Although I have to admit that I haven't been able to find this convention in 
any printed or scanned breviary I have except the Anglican (1955, I think).  
Nor in the chant books, where it matters possibly more because the chant such 
cases leaves off the antiphon in the middle and continues with the psalm tone.

Original comment by a...@malton.name on 10 Nov 2011 at 11:52

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
It is used in the 1961 editio typica, though rarely, because the new 
translation of the psalms often makes the beginning of the psalm differ from 
the antiphon. An example of its use is Feria II ad Laudes I, Ant. 5 (p.87).

A 1941 breviary by Desclée uses both single and double daggers: single daggers 
for an incipit that corresponds, and double daggers for an antiphon that 
corresponds. Sometimes only the incipit is given before the psalm, followed by 
a single dagger. The full antiphon appears at the end, e.g., Dominica ad 
Matutinum, ant. 7:

    Ant. Ut quid, Domine. †

    Ut quid, Domine, † recessisti longe, * despicis in opportunitatibus, in tribulatione?
    ....

    Ant. Ut quid, Domine, recessisti longe?

Elsewhere, both single and double daggers are used, e.g., Feria IV ad 
Mattutinum, ant. 7:

    Ant. Deus deórum, * † Dóminus locútus est. ‡

    Deus deórum, † Dóminus locútus est: * ‡ et vocávit terram,
    ...

In the ordinary form, the breviaries for Italy and Germany use this convention, 
and I'm fairly sure it's in the original Latin as well. At least in Italy, 
daggers are used even when the beginning of the psalm doesn't perfectly 
correspond to the antiphon. ICEL eliminated the daggers in its English 
translation.

Original comment by a...@liturgiaetmusica.com on 11 Nov 2011 at 8:38

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago

Original comment by a...@malton.name on 13 Nov 2011 at 2:54

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
This issue was closed by revision r296.

Original comment by igregord on 3 Dec 2011 at 10:19

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
This issue was closed by revision r297.

Original comment by igregord on 3 Dec 2011 at 10:48

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
[deleted comment]
GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
[deleted comment]
GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
r296 and r297 went a long way toward fixing this, but one minor issue remains: 
"When [the antiphon] matches the whole first verse, the dagger should come at 
the beginning of the second verse instead of the end of the first."

Original comment by a...@liturgiaetmusica.com on 5 Dec 2011 at 4:24

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Sorry, I missed that part. Fixed in r304.

Original comment by igregord on 5 Dec 2011 at 10:51