Closed maryjom closed 1 year ago
The big discussion here is does this mean the whole window or just blocks of content. How something like this could be tested may give us insights into what could be required.
For example, if you treat each block of content as being the testing unit you would then need to measure that block of content with something like a pixel ruler and then adapt the view in different ways if it did not fit or meet an exception to determine if it could pass.
Small nitpick, but "Except for parts of the content which require two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning." isn't bulleted in WCAG 2.1
@oh185014 Thanks. Fixed.
Taking into account information and others' input in the GitHub discussion thread, and the discussion we had in the 23 February meeting.
Here's my first attempt at draft WCAG2ICT content:
From Success Criterion 1.4.10:
Content can be presented without loss of information or functionality, and without requiring scrolling in two dimensions for:
- Vertical scrolling content at a width equivalent to 320 CSS pixels;
- Horizontal scrolling content at a height equivalent to 256 CSS pixels.
Except for parts of the content which require two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning.
NOTE: 320 CSS pixels is equivalent to a starting viewport width of 1280 CSS pixels wide at 400% zoom. For web content which is designed to scroll horizontally (e.g., with vertical text), 256 CSS pixels is equivalent to a starting viewport height of 1024 CSS pixels at 400% zoom.
NOTE: Examples of content which requires two-dimensional layout are images required for understanding (such as maps and diagrams), video, games, presentations, data tables (not individual cells), and interfaces where it is necessary to keep toolbars in view while manipulating content. It is acceptable to provide two-dimensional scrolling for such parts of the content.
This applies directly as written, and as described in Intent from Understanding Success Criterion 1.4.10 (also provided below), replacing “CSS Pixels” with "device-independent pixels" and “web content” with “content”.
With these substitutions, it would read:
Content can be presented without loss of information or functionality, and without requiring scrolling in two dimensions for:
- Vertical scrolling content at a width equivalent to 320 [device independent pixels];
- Horizontal scrolling content at a height equivalent to 256 [device independent pixels].
Except for parts of the content which require two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning.
NOTE: 320 [Device independent pixels] are equivalent to a starting viewport width of 1280 [device independent pixels] wide at 400% zoom. For [content] which is designed to scroll horizontally (e.g., with vertical text), 256 [device independent pixels] is equivalent to a starting viewport height of 1024 [device independent pixels] at 400% zoom.
NOTE: Examples of content which requires two-dimensional layout are images required for understanding (such as maps and diagrams), video, games, presentations, data tables (not individual cells), and interfaces where it is necessary to keep toolbars in view while manipulating content. It is acceptable to provide two-dimensional scrolling for such parts of the content.
For non-web documents:
Note 1: If the document type or the user agent don't provide reflow capabilities, then the document content requires two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning and would meet the exception of this Success Criterion.
For non-web software:
Note 1: The intent section refers to the ability for reflow content when user agent text enlargement is used to scale content or when the viewport changes in width. For non-web software, this would mean that when those features are used, the content will reflow without loss of information or functionality, and without requiring scrolling in two dimensions or that the application works with the platform features that meet this requirement.
Note 2: It is likely that for non-web software there will be more frequent cases where two-dimensional layout is required for usage or meaning. For example:
Note 3: See also the discussion on Closed Functionality
In the Key Terms section add a definition for device independent pixels.
visual angle of about 0.0213 degrees
Note: This unit is density-independent, and distinct from actual hardware pixels present in a display. The physical size of a device-independent pixel depends on the assumed viewing distance between the user and the hardware.
Example: In the case of a mobile phone, the assumed viewing distance is considered to be an arm's length, which is around 28 inches (71 cm). At that viewing distance, the size of a device-independent pixel is 0.26 mm.
In Appendix A: Success Criteria that are Problematic for Closed Functionality add the following bullet and explanation:
I commend the TF for working through this tough SC. @rachaelbradley, I hope some of the concepts in the discussion are incorporated into WCAG 3.0 migration considerations. I added a WCAG next label to it.
Regarding https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/issues/98#issuecomment-1486214488
For non-web documents:
Note 1: If the document type or the user agent don't provide reflow capabilities, then the document content requires two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning and would meet the exception of this Success Criterion.
Issue: Some PDF user agents provide reflow and others do not. Some "document types" of PDF support reflow and others do not. Need to clarify this situation.
Proposed: If there is no available user agent for the document type, such that the combination of the user agent and the document type support reflow, then the two-dimensional layout exception applies.
For non-web documents:
Note 1: If a document type and its available user agents don't provide reflow capabilities, then the document content requires two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning and would meet the exception of this Success Criterion.
Relevant: https://github.com/w3c/wcag/issues/814
The "device independent pixel" definition is on the right track, but I have concerns which we can discuss on the conference call.
From https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/issues/98#issuecomment-1486214488
device independent pixel visual angle of about 0.0213 degrees **Note:** This unit is density-independent, and distinct from actual hardware pixels present in a display. The physical size of a device-independent pixel depends on the assumed viewing distance between the user and the hardware. **Example:** In the case of a mobile phone, the assumed viewing distance is considered to be an arm's length, which is around 28 inches (71 cm). At that viewing distance, the size of a device-independent pixel is 0.26 mm.
Nit: Better to say "in the case of a mobile phone app"
My concerns for discussion:
As I've https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/discussions/101#discussioncomment-5233702, Android defines a device independent pixel. It turns out to be 1/160 of inch or 0.15875 mm, not 0.26 mm.
note that these definitions don't necessarily match the reality of different physical screen dimensions between devices. they're an approximation/idealised measure at best (just like CSS pixels, which can vary wildly between different monitors/devices)
to take an example: pick up two different android (or even iOS) devices with differing screen sizes, and measure (with a physical ruler) the size of interface components defined in dps (or Apple "points"). they will vary.
Edits and questions for non-web software
From https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/issues/98#issuecomment-1486214488:
For non-web software: **Note 1:** The intent section refers to the ability for reflow content when user agent text enlargement is used to scale content or when the viewport changes in width. For non-web software, this would mean that when those features are used, the content will reflow without loss of information or functionality, and without requiring scrolling in two dimensions or that the application works with the platform features that meet this requirement. **Note 2:** It is likely that for non-web software there will be more frequent cases where two-dimensional layout is required for usage or meaning. For example: - If the platform software does not provide reflow capabilities. - When the software has a complex user interface with toolbars, as explained in the intent of [Understanding 1.4.10 Reflow](https://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG22/Understanding/reflow.html). - When the size of the viewport and the size of the content cannot be altered.
Issues:
Proposed:
For non-web software: **Note 1:** The intent section refers to the ability for content to reflow when user agent text enlargement is used to scale content or when the viewport changes in width. For non-web software, this means that when users scale content, adjust the size of a window or dialog, or change the screen resolution, the content will reflow without loss of information or functionality, and without requiring scrolling in two dimensions; or that the application works with platform features to meet this requirement. **Note 2:** It is likely that for non-web software there will be more frequent cases where two-dimensional layout is required for usage or meaning. For example: - If the [content technology](https://www.w3.org/TR/wcag2ict/#wcag2ict-def_technology) and platform software do not provide reflow capabilities. - When the software has a complex user interface with toolbars, as explained in the intent of [Understanding 1.4.10 Reflow](https://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG22/Understanding/reflow.html). - When the [content technology](https://www.w3.org/TR/wcag2ict/#wcag2ict-def_technology) and platform software do not allow users to alter the size of an application window or its content.
I'd also like to discuss how 1.4.10 applies to software on platforms that support size alteration, yet put limitations on the possible size.
Today I filed https://github.com/w3c/wcag/issues/3151
Is it useful to clarify this also in a note for WCAG2ICT?
As I've #101 (comment), Android defines a device independent pixel. It turns out to be 1/160 of inch or 0.15875 mm, not 0.26 mm.
note that these definitions don't necessarily match the reality of different physical screen dimensions between devices. they're an approximation/idealised measure at best (just like CSS pixels, which can vary wildly between different monitors/devices)
to take an example: pick up two different android (or even iOS) devices with differing screen sizes, and measure (with a physical ruler) the size of interface components defined in dps (or Apple "points"). they will vary.
@patrickhlauke I agree that's a true statement. However, I'm not clear if you are advocating for or against my suggestion. Would you prefer that WCAG2ICT use or not use platform-defined dips when evaluating mobile and desktop software for 1.4.10?
Responding to closed functionality in https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/issues/98#issuecomment-1486214488
1.4.10 Reflow - because the text reflow support in a closed environment may be more limited than the support found in user agents for the Web, meeting Success Criterion 1.4.10 in a closed environment may place a much heavier burden on the content author, especially when there are memory-constraints. Additionally, some products with closed functionality have very small screens where two-dimensional scrolling is required for usage of the software functionality.
I'd like to add something like this:
Compared with other non-web software, closed functionality is more likely to prevent users from adjusting the size of application windows and content.
Also rephrase so we're not comparing closed functionality to web, but comparing it to non-closed software.
I'm not clear if you are advocating for or against my suggestion
not making any statement for or against. just pointing out that definitions that try to pin things down to a definitive size as measured on screen will almost certainly only be idealised/not correct...
The assumption for 1.4.10 was that if a user agent does not reflow then a failure on that agent will not fail the criterion. However, if another user agent does reflow for that data type, the developer is required to reflow on that user agent. Here is an example:
PDF will reflow in Acrobat if the file is formatted correctly. So, on Acrobat the PDF should word wrap. However, many math papers that are written to PDF from TeX or LaTeX. This uses the Knuth-Plass algorithm to justify pages. Because PDF is printer oriented, spaces are not used to separate some word sequences. Instead, the words are positioned to fit exact adjustments of white space. There is no white space character between them. When a user agent tries to reflow the words in these sequences are concatenated into a long jumble of meaningless letters like: longjumbleofmeaninglessletters .
The document will not reflow in a functional form on a user agent that supports reflow. Thus, it does not meet 1.4.10, because the authoring tool fails to produce reflowable text.
Best, Wayne
device independent pixel or css pixels needs to be taken up as it own topic. Some systems don’t have idea of pixel size, not changeable by author. This is a case where web requirement is not reverent and should not be applied. There are already other requirements for text size outside of wcag2itc. In addition to adding note 3 from MJ comment into this SC the closed products section a general note about pixels should be added as it css pixels or device independent pixels are in other SC also.
device-independent pixel visual angle of about 0.0213 degrees
Note: This unit is density-independent, and distinct from actual hardware pixels present in a display. The physical size of a device-independent pixel depends on the assumed viewing distance between the user and the hardware, as well as the platform. The platform may have its own standard device-independent measurement.
Example: In the case of a computer screen, the assumed viewing distance is considered to be an arm's length, which is around 28 inches (71 cm). At that viewing distance, the size of a device-independent pixel is 0.26 mm.
While the definition is appropriate I can't help but wonder given that this SC is aimed at users with low vision that we should at least acknowledge somewhere that people with low vision would likely not be using the device at such a viewing distance. but that this is the standard viewing distance.
@mraccess77 I think that is true for web content as well - not just the application of WCAG to non-web ICT. If it is generally true for all tech, any statement to that effect should go into WCAG. WCAG's definition is based on the CSS reference pixel and that is how it is defined.
+1 for discussion on CSS reference pixel / device independent be address separately from 1.4.10 Reflow.
The conversation at the end of today's call was on reflow. From recently proposed above:
For non-web documents: Note 1: If a document type and its available user agents don't provide reflow capabilities, then the document content requires two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning and would meet the exception of this Success Criterion.
I came away thinking the note should be more narrow, and also make refence to the fact that not all file format are accessibility supported. I propose for consideration something like:
Note 1: An example of non-web documents which require two-dimensional layout for usage are nature photographs.
Note 2: Not all document types support reflow, and some document types do not support reflow on some user agents. Such limitations are not under author control, but that does not mean that the content requires two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning. Such limitations might mean that the document type is not accessibility supported.
@bruce-usab I like the direction you're heading with this. I have some tweaks in mind. Here's a proposed adjustment to your suggestion.
Note 1: Examples of non-web documents which require two-dimensional layout for usage are nature photographs or documents intended only for printing or archival of print format material.
Note 2: Reflow may not be accessibility supported by all document types and user agents. Such limitations are not under author control, but this does not mean the document requires two-dimensional layout for usage or meaning.
I thought I'd provide a reality check on recent discussion. Namely, as someone with a decent background understanding of Reflow who has not heavily followed this thread, neither version of Note 1 makes it clear to me 1) why a nature photograph would be excluded, nor 2) why it would be considered a non-web document.
So i think you need a bit more explanation in those notes. First, there is no reason that a photograph cannot be reduced to fit the available space. It may become so small that it is essentially a thumbnail which cannot serve the same purpose as a high-resolution archival photo, but there is no reason that the representation of any image cannot fit in a confined space.
WCAG uses the phrase
images required for understanding (such as maps and diagrams),
In the context of WCAG2ICT, I'd be inclined to work in some concept of "original size" or even "high resolution" to try to tackle the context that information must be presented beyond the physical dimensions of a device to achieve its intended function. I assume that's where you were going with "archival", but I think it needs a bit more. I also think an example of an actual non-web document format would be useful.
Maybe something like:
Examples of non-web documents which require two-dimensional layout for usage, and so require horizontal scrolling, are high resolution archival photographs or documents stored in a ___ system.
In the context of WCAG2ICT...
I'd again wonder if a fundamental concept/clarification would not benefit from being ported directly "upstream" to WCAG 2.x rather than just in WCAG2ICT
I took a stab at part of the potential improvement of existing wording in https://github.com/w3c/wcag/pull/3179
I don't see this going anywhere in 2.x backlog, but @rachaelbradley I do think it is another thing to consider for 3.0.
As well, on further consideration, I think the future of this SC is going to be better served by creating a more advanced version of Resize text:
Reflow Text AA A mode of operation exists where text can be resized up to 200 percent without loss of content or functionality, and without requiring scrolling unless a specific two-dimensional presentation of text is essential.
We need some research to establish what besides text we expect to reflow, and we also need some research to find out what percentage of material can successfully meet 200% while failing at 400%. My suspicion is the majority of material that passes at 200% will pass at larger magnification where the user agent has that ability. The reason I've pulled back from 400% in this suggested wording is because IMO it is not an achievable goal when starting from a small form factor. The only real way I see to find out what is realistic to achieve across form factors is to do research. 400% is a nice target on a desktop. Maybe we can come up with a formula based on percentage of the viewport area.
Re @mbgower's suggestion - it depends - SC 1.4.8 covers some of this but only horizontally. Also, the 400% could be achievable for other formats like documents - but perhaps not for UI layed out text on small screens in software - however, on larger screens I would not want to lose the 400% where it is possible. I wonder if there is some other measure such as percent of screen width or height that could be used.
I did some calculations with CSS reference pixel size and the angle of viewing to see what that might mean as far as physical size for a 320x280 viewport. Doing the math (assuming I did it right), the viewport size for reflow doesn't seem to make sense outside of the web. How would you actually test this? Many software windows don't resize to the calculated dimensions. I have a table of use cases with the calculations I made. I checked the reference pixel size compared to the one in the CSS reference pixel size explanation to ensure I was calculating that part correctly. After that, you simply multiply by 320 to get the vertical dimension and 256 to get the horizontal dimension.
After doing the math using the reference angle and the law of sines, calculating reference pixel size = .000376378028864 * distance from the device. Multiply that by 320 to get the horizontal size, or by 256 to get the vertical size. I looked up reference distances for each use cases from ergonomic data. These are all ranges, as everyone has a slightly different distance they use their device that might be optimal for that user.
The following table contains the resulting calculations. I'm not sure how to take into account the difference in platform display density, as these results seem to be quite small in size and on my Mac, I am unable to resize windows as small as the resulting viewport size.
<html xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
Example use case | Viewing Distance | Reference pixel Size | Viewport Vertical size | Viewport Horizontal size -- | -- | -- | -- | -- Phone | 16-18 in (40.6-45.7 cm) | .0060-.0067 in (.153-.172 mm) | 1.93-2.17 in (4.89-5.50 cm) | 1.54-1.73 in (3.91-4.40 cm) Tablet | 16-30 in (40-76 cm) | .0059-.0111 in (.151-.286 mm) | 1.90-3.60 in (4.82-9.15 cm) | 1.52-2.88 in (3.85-7.32 cm) Desktop display | 20-40 in (50-100 cm) | .0073-.0148 in (.188-.376 mm) | 2.37-4.74 in (6.02-12.0 cm) | 1.90-3.79 in (4.82-9.64 cm)
From Success Criterion 1.4.10:
Additional Guidance When Applying Success Criterion 1.4.10 to Non-Web Documents and Software:
This applies directly as written, and as described in Intent from Understanding Success Criterion 1.4.10 (also provided below), replacing “web content” with “content”.
With these substitutions, it would read:
DISCUSSION NEEDED We need a discussion to happen before notes are developed, based on some circumstances I have been thinking about:
Some potential notes for the WCAG2ICT guidance: Note: Some software runs on technologies where there is no method to zoom content to 400% or reflow content, or the screen is smaller than a mobile device; it would not be possible to meet this success criterion with those technologies. Note: It is likely that for software there will be more frequent cases where two-dimensional layout are required for usage or meaning. Note: CSS pixel measurements would have to be converted to another measurement for non-web technologies.
dfn-CSS-pixel
From the WCAG 2.2 definition for CSS pixel:
DISCUSSION NEEDED What does a CSS pixel mean for non-web technologies? Is there a conversion that makes sense and how is that done?