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Defend Option #128

Open GoogleCodeExporter opened 9 years ago

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
I think there should be a defend option, where you use AP to position yourself 
for a better defense against the attacker. Realistically if you are using up 
all your energy in an attack, you are less likely to defend well, but if you 
reserve some energy for defense you can better defend yourself.

Let's say you have a weapon that uses 3 AP and you decide to only attack twice 
and defend with the remaining 4 AP, your block chance should increase. Or if 
you use all your AP trying to run away, your defenses are not as good either.

Original issue reported on code.google.com by joeybea...@gmail.com on 12 Jan 2011 at 8:10

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Good idea, how about calculating 5% blockchance per remaining Ap?
"For example if you use a weapon with 3Ap and you attack...
1 -> 7 ap left => block +35%
2 -> 4 ap left => block +20%
3 -> 1 ap left => block +5%
........for this round against every attack"
That would bring a tactical aspect to the fight like as an enemy is too strong 
for you (makes 20-30 dmg) but has only one weak point: his attack chance. So 
you could only try to land 1 hit every round but to improve your block chance 
in order not getting 1 or 2 hitted.

Original comment by michisch...@web.de on 12 Jan 2011 at 11:02

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Indeed a good idea. 5% BC per AP un-used also seems like a good value.
It also brings forth a new tactic, defensive aggression. If we add new item 
properties, and skills when they get added, to support type like repelled 
damage and multiple turn damage like fire or poison damage.

Original comment by kims...@gmail.com on 13 Jan 2011 at 12:25

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
I think 5% BC may be a bit too much. I have 16% BC and while I'm vulnerable I 
mostly win before the opponent could harm enough. ;) Imagine this being boosted 
to 21 (3 attacks) or 36 (2 attacks). My character would be almost invincible. ;)

Also, this feature influences slow weapons' worth, but I can't tell whether up 
or down.
Apparently, an AP10 weapon would be an awful choice while AP6 may be quite a 
good choice if does significantly more damage than an AP5 one.

Original comment by surrano on 13 Jan 2011 at 5:47

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
How many attacks do you get, surrano?

Original comment by joeybea...@gmail.com on 13 Jan 2011 at 7:02

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Hm i guess you're right. 5% seems to be too much. Juat think of skillable ap 
points; you would get 1ap and 5%bc for every skill level. 

So i think this is still a quite good idea, but the given boost should be 
limited to 3% or even 2%bc per remaining ap.

(Btw: i've just 4% bc but a buttload of dmg ;-) )

Original comment by michisch...@web.de on 13 Jan 2011 at 8:27

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
I've also an additional idea: im sure most of us do have a lot of gold x>20.000 
; so how about not only introducing a new skill system (see the other issue), 
we also could place womething like a "grand champion of melee" where you can 
increase you stats for gold: per 1 dmg/ac/bc/hp - 10.000gold

Original comment by michisch...@web.de on 14 Jan 2011 at 12:06

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Perhaps block should only be possible to perform last in a round and have a 
base cost, let's say 4 AP, which gives +5% block chance. Any additional APs 
could give higher block chance, say +1% per AP.

With a 3 AP weapon you could then:
Attack 3 times (3 *3 AP) and 1 remaining AP.
Attack 2 times (2 * 3 AP) and block (4 AP = +5%).
Attack 1 time (3 AP) and block (7 AP = +8%).
Just block (10 AP = +11%).

What do you say?

Original comment by johan.si...@gmail.com on 14 Jan 2011 at 5:56

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
It's also good. But there is a third possibillity:
1ap left - +0%bc
2ap left - +0%bc
3ap left - +1%bc
4ap left - +2%bc
5ap left - +4%bc
6ap left - +8%bc
7ap left - +16%bc
8ap left - +32%bc
9ap left - + 32%bc
10ap left - + 32%bc
....and so on? That would really bring the defensive agression tactic to the 
game

@Oskar: what do you say?

Original comment by michisch...@web.de on 14 Jan 2011 at 1:49

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
re 7,8: these, again, favour fast weapons a bit too much. 
Thinking about it again and again, this issue influences "only" replayability. 
Whatever the exact formulae are, the ideal combination can be found. This issue 
may help getting more equally ideal formulae, though. Personally, I think 
anything exponential is overreacting things.

Original comment by surrano on 17 Jan 2011 at 8:39

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
#c9 Are you suggesting that any +% BC bonus should last longer than the next 
turn ?
Favoring fast weapons is obvious as they use less AP which means more APs to do 
stuff.

Original comment by kims...@gmail.com on 18 Jan 2011 at 5:10

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Good ideas. However, I'm not too sure about using the excess APs as defense. 
Instead, I think we should find ways to allow the player to use up the APs. 

For example, in Fallout 1 & 2 you could do special attacks that used more APs, 
where you would gain accuracy and/or damage by using them instead of the 
regular attack. This is something that I think we should start thinking about. 
"Aimed attack" / "Power attack" that uses up 1 or 2 more APs than the regular 
attack. This way, you can choose the attack depending on the circumstance. If 
the boss has 1HP left, you may want to do the aimed attack to make sure you 
score a hit, and not care about how many AP you use.

Original comment by oskar.wi...@gmail.com on 29 Jan 2011 at 9:58

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
I'm a fan. Great idea.

Original comment by doug_y...@hotmail.com on 29 Jan 2011 at 7:44

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
Add "defensive attack" to the lot and everyone will be happy :)
e.g.
Aimed attack: + A(ap) to AC 
Power attack: + P(ap) to damage
Feint:        + F(ap) to crit %
Def. attack:  + D(ap) to BC
Swift attack: - S(ap) to AC

What I would like to point out:
- These are functions of ap, not necessarily linear. 
- Of course, may be a constant benefit for a constant ap, and not scalable. 
I.e. cannot apply the same feat twice for the same attack
- The functions may differ, but probably it would be easiest to use the same, 
with different constants maybe.
- There may be more variability, e.g. have pluses or minuses. 

One example for a variant is that you can make an attack balanced or extreme.
- balanced: you get single benefit and single deficit for 1AP
- focused: you get single benefit and no deficit for 2AP
- extreme: you get double benefit and single deficit for 2AP

Aimed attack: +5 AC / -3 BC
- balanced (1AP): +5 AC, -3 BC
- focused (2AP): +5 AC
- extreme (2AP): +10 AC, -3 BC

Power attack:     +1 damage / -3 BC
Feint:           +10% crit  / -5 AC
Defensive attack: +3 BC     / -5 AC
Swift attack:     -2 AP     / -1 damage

Note that Swift attack costs NEGATIVE AP, and may be way overpowered with a 3AP 
weapon:
- balanced: 3+1-2 = 2AP, -1 damage (5 attacks per round)
- focused:  3+2-2 = 3AP, same as normal attack
- extreme:  3+2-4 = 1AP, -2 damage (10 attacks per round!)
Maybe we could make it percentile, e.g. -20% damage, or double the deficit, 
e.g. damage AND crit% or damage AND AC

Original comment by surrano on 31 Jan 2011 at 9:31

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
how about just a Defend action that just like, doubles your defense percentage. 
Have it cost 4 AP.

Original comment by rqpa...@gmail.com on 3 Feb 2011 at 6:02

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
A defense option should be simple and either up your defense percentage or 
reduce the amount of damage you receive from the hostile npc's next turn.

Original comment by sdeva...@gmail.com on 10 Feb 2011 at 2:01

GoogleCodeExporter commented 9 years ago 
I also like the idea. Personally, I think it should max out around 4-5 AP left 
(instead of 8-10). I think the main advantage to this idea is to give the 
player a use for their remaining AP (especially if they have a 6AP weapon or 
something)

However, I wouldn't like to have to mash "defend" every turn, though.

Original comment by jch...@email.wm.edu on 5 Apr 2011 at 4:11