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.NET for iOS, Mac Catalyst, macOS, and tvOS provide open-source bindings of the Apple SDKs for use with .NET managed languages such as C#
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Crash in networking stack #20345

Open rolfbjarne opened 6 months ago

rolfbjarne commented 6 months ago

Use this test project: https://github.com/xamarin/xamarin-macios/issues/11799#issuecomment-1988244584

Run the project for a while (typically hours, sometimes overnight - at one point it crashed after 16 hours / just over 1.5M network requests), and it eventually crashes.

lldb shows this stack trace:

(lldb) bt
* thread #1, name = 'tid_103', queue = 'com.apple.main-thread', stop reason = signal SIGSEGV
  * frame #0: 0x000000019d9e5c34 libobjc.A.dylib`objc_msgSend + 52
    frame #1: 0x000000019da18a5c libobjc.A.dylib`objc_object::sidetable_release(bool, bool) + 292
    frame #2: 0x00000001a30f169c CFNetwork`___lldb_unnamed_symbol2909 + 32
    frame #3: 0x00000001a30f1400 CFNetwork`___lldb_unnamed_symbol2903 + 260
    frame #4: 0x000000019dab717c libsystem_blocks.dylib`_call_dispose_helpers_excp + 48
    frame #5: 0x000000019dab6f48 libsystem_blocks.dylib`_Block_release + 252
    frame #6: 0x00000001a3194e7c CFNetwork`___lldb_unnamed_symbol5273 + 28
    frame #7: 0x000000019dab717c libsystem_blocks.dylib`_call_dispose_helpers_excp + 48
    frame #8: 0x000000019dab6f48 libsystem_blocks.dylib`_Block_release + 252
    frame #9: 0x000000019dc0a3e8 libdispatch.dylib`_dispatch_client_callout + 20
    frame #10: 0x000000019dc18bb8 libdispatch.dylib`_dispatch_main_queue_drain + 988
    frame #11: 0x000000019dc187cc libdispatch.dylib`_dispatch_main_queue_callback_4CF + 44
    frame #12: 0x000000019dedb4ac CoreFoundation`__CFRUNLOOP_IS_SERVICING_THE_MAIN_DISPATCH_QUEUE__ + 16
    frame #13: 0x000000019de98c30 CoreFoundation`__CFRunLoopRun + 1996
    frame #14: 0x000000019de97e0c CoreFoundation`CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 608
    frame #15: 0x00000001a8633000 HIToolbox`RunCurrentEventLoopInMode + 292
    frame #16: 0x00000001a8632e3c HIToolbox`ReceiveNextEventCommon + 648
    frame #17: 0x00000001a8632b94 HIToolbox`_BlockUntilNextEventMatchingListInModeWithFilter + 76
    frame #18: 0x00000001a16f0970 AppKit`_DPSNextEvent + 660
    frame #19: 0x00000001a1ee2dec AppKit`-[NSApplication(NSEventRouting) _nextEventMatchingEventMask:untilDate:inMode:dequeue:] + 700
    frame #20: 0x00000001a16e3cb8 AppKit`-[NSApplication run] + 476
    frame #21: 0x00000001a16baf54 AppKit`NSApplicationMain + 880
    frame #22: 0x00000001a190d610 AppKit`_NSApplicationMainWithInfoDictionary + 24
    frame #23: 0x00000001b71290dc UIKitMacHelper`UINSApplicationMain + 972
    frame #24: 0x00000001cd2159b4 UIKitCore`UIApplicationMain + 148
    frame #25: 0x0000000106879854 nsurlsessionhandler`xamarin_UIApplicationMain(argc=0, argv=0x00006000028144c0, principalClassName=0x0000000000000000, delegateClassName="AppDelegate", exception_gchandle=0x000000016fdfe8e0) at bindings.m:126:10
    frame #26: 0x00000001065c6280 nsurlsessionhandler`wrapper_managed_to_native_UIKit_UIApplication_xamarin_UIApplicationMain_int_intptr_intptr_intptr_intptr_ + 176
    frame #27: 0x0000000105db9614 nsurlsessionhandler`UIKit_UIApplication_UIApplicationMain_int_string___intptr_intptr + 100
    frame #28: 0x0000000105db9948 nsurlsessionhandler`UIKit_UIApplication_Main_string___System_Type_System_Type + 280
    frame #29: 0x0000000102492d68 nsurlsessionhandler`Program__Main__string__ + 136
    frame #30: 0x000000010508ea08 nsurlsessionhandler`wrapper_runtime_invoke_object_runtime_invoke_dynamic_intptr_intptr_intptr_intptr + 296
    frame #31: 0x0000000106b8ea90 nsurlsessionhandler`mono_jit_runtime_invoke(method=<unavailable>, obj=<unavailable>, params=<unavailable>, exc=<unavailable>, error=0x000000016fdfec90) at mini-runtime.c:3636:3 [opt]
    frame #32: 0x0000000106b2f158 nsurlsessionhandler`mono_runtime_invoke_checked [inlined] do_runtime_invoke(method=0x000000011a914598, obj=0x0000000000000000, params=0x000000016fdfec30, exc=0x0000000000000000, error=0x000000016fdfec90) at object.c:2576:11 [opt]
    frame #33: 0x0000000106b2f11c nsurlsessionhandler`mono_runtime_invoke_checked(method=0x000000011a914598, obj=0x0000000000000000, params=0x000000016fdfec30, error=0x000000016fdfec90) at object.c:2792:9 [opt]
    frame #34: 0x0000000106b35494 nsurlsessionhandler`mono_runtime_exec_main_checked [inlined] do_exec_main_checked(method=0x000000011a914598, args=<unavailable>, error=0x000000016fdfec90) at object.c:0 [opt]
    frame #35: 0x0000000106b35458 nsurlsessionhandler`mono_runtime_exec_main_checked(method=0x000000011a914598, args=<unavailable>, error=0x000000016fdfec90) at object.c:4775:9 [opt]
    frame #36: 0x0000000106b35540 nsurlsessionhandler`mono_runtime_run_main_checked(method=<unavailable>, argc=<unavailable>, argv=<unavailable>, error=<unavailable>) at object.c:4339:9 [opt] [artificial]
    frame #37: 0x0000000106be1434 nsurlsessionhandler`mono_jit_exec at driver.c:1369:13 [opt]
    frame #38: 0x0000000106be1424 nsurlsessionhandler`mono_jit_exec(domain=<unavailable>, assembly=<unavailable>, argc=1, argv=0x000000016fdfed10) at driver.c:1314:7 [opt]
    frame #39: 0x00000001068a2e58 nsurlsessionhandler`xamarin_main(argc=1, argv=0x000000016fdff070, launch_mode=XamarinLaunchModeApp) at monotouch-main.m:495:8
    frame #40: 0x0000000106d47b18 nsurlsessionhandler`main(argc=1, argv=0x000000016fdff070) at main.arm64.mm:416:11
    frame #41: 0x000000019da320e0 dyld`start + 2360

manually symbolicating the stack using backtrace in lldb shows:

(lldb) parray 20 (char **) 0x000000011aa14800
(char **) $1 = 0x000000011aa14800 {
  [0] = 0x000000011aa148a0 "0   ???                                 0x000000010f58c64c 0x0 + 4552443468"
  [1] = 0x000000011aa148ec "1   nsurlsessionhandler                 0x0000000106d47ad8 main + 0"
  [2] = 0x000000011aa14930 "2   CFNetwork                           0x00000001a30f169c CFURLRequestGetMainDocumentURL + 20720"
  [3] = 0x000000011aa14992 "3   CFNetwork                           0x00000001a30f1400 CFURLRequestGetMainDocumentURL + 20052"
  [4] = 0x000000011aa149f4 "4   libsystem_blocks.dylib              0x000000019dab717c _call_dispose_helpers_excp + 48"
  [5] = 0x000000011aa14a4f "5   libsystem_blocks.dylib              0x000000019dab6f48 _Block_release + 252"
  [6] = 0x000000011aa14a9f "6   CFNetwork                           0x00000001a3194e7c CFURLCredentialStorageCopyAllCredentials + 40380"
  [7] = 0x000000011aa14b0b "7   libsystem_blocks.dylib              0x000000019dab717c _call_dispose_helpers_excp + 48"
  [8] = 0x000000011aa14b66 "8   libsystem_blocks.dylib              0x000000019dab6f48 _Block_release + 252"
  [9] = 0x000000011aa14bb6 "9   libdispatch.dylib                   0x000000019dc0a3e8 _dispatch_client_callout + 20"
  [10] = 0x000000011aa14c0f "10  libdispatch.dylib                   0x000000019dc18bb8 _dispatch_main_queue_drain + 988"
  [11] = 0x000000011aa14c6b "11  libdispatch.dylib                   0x000000019dc187cc _dispatch_main_queue_callback_4CF + 44"
  [12] = 0x000000011aa14ccd "12  CoreFoundation                      0x000000019dedb4ac __CFRUNLOOP_IS_SERVICING_THE_MAIN_DISPATCH_QUEUE__ + 16"
  [13] = 0x000000011aa14d40 "13  CoreFoundation                      0x000000019de98c30 __CFRunLoopRun + 1996"
  [14] = 0x000000011aa14d91 "14  CoreFoundation                      0x000000019de97e0c CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 608"
  [15] = 0x000000011aa14de7 "15  HIToolbox                           0x00000001a8633000 RunCurrentEventLoopInMode + 292"
  [16] = 0x000000011aa14e42 "16  HIToolbox                           0x00000001a8632e3c ReceiveNextEventCommon + 648"
  [17] = 0x000000011aa14e9a "17  HIToolbox                           0x00000001a8632b94 _BlockUntilNextEventMatchingListInModeWithFilter + 76"
  [18] = 0x000000011aa14f0b "18  AppKit                              0x00000001a16f0970 _DPSNextEvent + 660"
  [19] = 0x000000011aa14f5a "19  AppKit                              0x00000001a1ee2dec -[NSApplication(NSEventRouting) _nextEventMatchingEventMask:untilDate:inMode:dequeue:] + 700"
}

Some investigation in lldb revelead:

Some more lldb info:


(lldb) disass
CFNetwork`___lldb_unnamed_symbol2909: # [__NSCFURLSessionConnection dealloc]
    0x1a30f167c <+0>:   pacibsp
    0x1a30f1680 <+4>:   sub    sp, sp, #0x30
    0x1a30f1684 <+8>:   stp    x20, x19, [sp, #0x10]
    0x1a30f1688 <+12>:  stp    x29, x30, [sp, #0x20]
    0x1a30f168c <+16>:  add    x29, sp, #0x20
    0x1a30f1690 <+20>:  mov    x19, x0
    0x1a30f1694 <+24>:  ldr    x0, [x0, #0x8]
    0x1a30f1698 <+28>:  bl     0x1a3359158               ; symbol stub for: objc_release
->  0x1a30f169c <+32>:  ldr    x0, [x19, #0x10]
    0x1a30f16a0 <+36>:  cbz    x0, 0x1a30f16ac           ; <+48>
    0x1a30f16a4 <+40>:  bl     0x1a3357578               ; symbol stub for: dispatch_release
    0x1a30f16a8 <+44>:  str    xzr, [x19, #0x10]
    0x1a30f16ac <+48>:  mov    x0, x19
    0x1a30f16b0 <+52>:  mov    x2, #0x0
    0x1a30f16b4 <+56>:  mov    w3, #0x18
    0x1a30f16b8 <+60>:  bl     0x1a33591c8               ; symbol stub for: objc_setProperty_atomic
    0x1a30f16bc <+64>:  ldr    x0, [x19, #0x28]
    0x1a30f16c0 <+68>:  cbz    x0, 0x1a30f16cc           ; <+80>
    0x1a30f16c4 <+72>:  bl     0x1a3359158               ; symbol stub for: objc_release
    0x1a30f16c8 <+76>:  str    xzr, [x19, #0x28]
    0x1a30f16cc <+80>:  ldr    x0, [x19, #0x30]
    0x1a30f16d0 <+84>:  cbz    x0, 0x1a30f16dc           ; <+96>
    0x1a30f16d4 <+88>:  bl     0x1a3357578               ; symbol stub for: dispatch_release
    0x1a30f16d8 <+92>:  str    xzr, [x19, #0x30]
    0x1a30f16dc <+96>:  adrp   x8, 424846
    0x1a30f16e0 <+100>: ldr    x8, [x8, #0x890]
    0x1a30f16e4 <+104>: stp    x19, x8, [sp]
    0x1a30f16e8 <+108>: adrp   x8, 373089
    0x1a30f16ec <+112>: add    x1, x8, #0x71f
    0x1a30f16f0 <+116>: mov    x0, sp
    0x1a30f16f4 <+120>: bl     0x1a33590f8               ; symbol stub for: objc_msgSendSuper2
    0x1a30f16f8 <+124>: ldp    x29, x30, [sp, #0x20]
    0x1a30f16fc <+128>: ldp    x20, x19, [sp, #0x10]
    0x1a30f1700 <+132>: add    sp, sp, #0x30
    0x1a30f1704 <+136>: retab

(lldb) disass
CFNetwork`___lldb_unnamed_symbol2903: # [__NSCFURLLocalSessionConnection dealloc]
    0x1a30f12fc <+0>:   pacibsp
    0x1a30f1300 <+4>:   sub    sp, sp, #0x30
    0x1a30f1304 <+8>:   stp    x20, x19, [sp, #0x10]
    0x1a30f1308 <+12>:  stp    x29, x30, [sp, #0x20]
    0x1a30f130c <+16>:  add    x29, sp, #0x20
    0x1a30f1310 <+20>:  mov    x19, x0
    0x1a30f1314 <+24>:  adrp   x8, 399283
    0x1a30f1318 <+28>:  ldrsw  x20, [x8, #0x414]
    0x1a30f131c <+32>:  ldr    x0, [x0, x20]
    0x1a30f1320 <+36>:  cbz    x0, 0x1a30f134c           ; <+80>
    0x1a30f1324 <+40>:  ldr    x16, [x0]
    0x1a30f1328 <+44>:  mov    x17, x0
    0x1a30f132c <+48>:  movk   x17, #0x81be, lsl #48
    0x1a30f1330 <+52>:  autda  x16, x17
    0x1a30f1334 <+56>:  ldr    x8, [x16, #0x8]!
    0x1a30f1338 <+60>:  mov    x9, x16
    0x1a30f133c <+64>:  mov    x17, x9
    0x1a30f1340 <+68>:  movk   x17, #0x990e, lsl #48
    0x1a30f1344 <+72>:  blraa  x8, x17
    0x1a30f1348 <+76>:  str    xzr, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f134c <+80>:  adrp   x8, 399283
    0x1a30f1350 <+84>:  ldrsw  x20, [x8, #0x410]
    0x1a30f1354 <+88>:  ldr    x0, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f1358 <+92>:  cbz    x0, 0x1a30f1384           ; <+136>
    0x1a30f135c <+96>:  ldr    x16, [x0]
    0x1a30f1360 <+100>: mov    x17, x0
    0x1a30f1364 <+104>: movk   x17, #0x4399, lsl #48
    0x1a30f1368 <+108>: autda  x16, x17
    0x1a30f136c <+112>: ldr    x8, [x16, #0x8]!
    0x1a30f1370 <+116>: mov    x9, x16
    0x1a30f1374 <+120>: mov    x17, x9
    0x1a30f1378 <+124>: movk   x17, #0x3f8b, lsl #48
    0x1a30f137c <+128>: blraa  x8, x17
    0x1a30f1380 <+132>: str    xzr, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f1384 <+136>: adrp   x8, 399283
    0x1a30f1388 <+140>: ldrsw  x20, [x8, #0x41c]
    0x1a30f138c <+144>: ldr    x0, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f1390 <+148>: cbz    x0, 0x1a30f139c           ; <+160>
    0x1a30f1394 <+152>: bl     0x1a3359158               ; symbol stub for: objc_release
    0x1a30f1398 <+156>: str    xzr, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f139c <+160>: adrp   x8, 399283
    0x1a30f13a0 <+164>: ldrsw  x20, [x8, #0x420]
    0x1a30f13a4 <+168>: ldr    x0, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f13a8 <+172>: cbz    x0, 0x1a30f13b4           ; <+184>
    0x1a30f13ac <+176>: bl     0x1a3357578               ; symbol stub for: dispatch_release
    0x1a30f13b0 <+180>: str    xzr, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f13b4 <+184>: adrp   x8, 399283
    0x1a30f13b8 <+188>: ldrsw  x20, [x8, #0x424]
    0x1a30f13bc <+192>: ldr    x0, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f13c0 <+196>: cbz    x0, 0x1a30f13cc           ; <+208>
    0x1a30f13c4 <+200>: bl     0x1a3357578               ; symbol stub for: dispatch_release
    0x1a30f13c8 <+204>: str    xzr, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f13cc <+208>: adrp   x8, 399283
    0x1a30f13d0 <+212>: ldrsw  x20, [x8, #0x428]
    0x1a30f13d4 <+216>: ldr    x0, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f13d8 <+220>: cbz    x0, 0x1a30f13e4           ; <+232>
    0x1a30f13dc <+224>: bl     0x1a3359158               ; symbol stub for: objc_release
    0x1a30f13e0 <+228>: str    xzr, [x19, x20]
    0x1a30f13e4 <+232>: adrp   x8, 424846
    0x1a30f13e8 <+236>: ldr    x8, [x8, #0x898]
    0x1a30f13ec <+240>: stp    x19, x8, [sp]
    0x1a30f13f0 <+244>: adrp   x8, 373089
    0x1a30f13f4 <+248>: add    x1, x8, #0x71f
    0x1a30f13f8 <+252>: mov    x0, sp
    0x1a30f13fc <+256>: bl     0x1a33590f8               ; symbol stub for: objc_msgSendSuper2
->  0x1a30f1400 <+260>: ldp    x29, x30, [sp, #0x20]
    0x1a30f1404 <+264>: ldp    x20, x19, [sp, #0x10]
    0x1a30f1408 <+268>: add    sp, sp, #0x30
    0x1a30f140c <+272>: retab

(lldb) disass
CFNetwork`___lldb_unnamed_symbol5273: # block dispose method
    0x1a3194e60 <+0>:  pacibsp
    0x1a3194e64 <+4>:  stp    x20, x19, [sp, #-0x20]!
    0x1a3194e68 <+8>:  stp    x29, x30, [sp, #0x10]
    0x1a3194e6c <+12>: add    x29, sp, #0x10
    0x1a3194e70 <+16>: mov    x19, x0
    0x1a3194e74 <+20>: ldr    x0, [x0, #0x30]
    0x1a3194e78 <+24>: bl     0x1a3359158               ; symbol stub for: objc_release
->  0x1a3194e7c <+28>: ldr    x0, [x19, #0x28]
    0x1a3194e80 <+32>: bl     0x1a3359158               ; symbol stub for: objc_release
    0x1a3194e84 <+36>: ldr    x0, [x19, #0x20]
    0x1a3194e88 <+40>: ldp    x29, x30, [sp, #0x10]
    0x1a3194e8c <+44>: ldp    x20, x19, [sp], #0x20
    0x1a3194e90 <+48>: autibsp
    0x1a3194e94 <+52>: eor    x16, x30, x30, lsl #1
    0x1a3194e98 <+56>: tbz    x16, #0x3e, 0x1a3194ea0   ; <+64>
    0x1a3194e9c <+60>: brk    #0xc471
    0x1a3194ea0 <+64>: b      0x1a3359158               ; symbol stub for: objc_release

(lldb) re re
General Purpose Registers:
        x0 = 0x000000011b8b5180
        x1 = 0x00000001fe25271f
        x2 = 0x0000600003fbe3c0
        x3 = 0x0000600003fbe3c0
        x4 = 0x0000600003fbe440
        x5 = 0x00000000000023c0
        x6 = 0x0000000000000000
        x7 = 0x0000000000000403
        x8 = 0x000000020a5f4e78  "dealloc"
        x9 = 0x000000020a5f4e78  "dealloc"
       x10 = 0x0000000400000041
       x11 = 0x0000000000000000
       x12 = 0x0000000000000000
       x13 = 0x0000000400000041
       x14 = 0x000000011b893ce0
       x15 = 0x000000011b893ce0
       x16 = 0x000000011b893ce0
       x17 = 0x0000000000000001
       x18 = 0x0000000000000000
       x19 = 0x000000011b8b5180
       x20 = 0x0000000000000001
       x21 = 0x0000000205ac7400  libobjc.A.dylib`(anonymous namespace)::SideTablesMap + 3072
       x22 = 0x0000000000000001
       x23 = 0x0000000000000104
       x24 = 0x0000000000000000
       x25 = 0x0000000205ac7ba0  dyld`_main_thread + 224
       x26 = 0x0000600003fbd100
       x27 = 0x000000000000000f
       x28 = 0x0000000000000000
        fp = 0x000000016fdfcea0
        lr = 0x000000019da18a5c  libobjc.A.dylib`objc_object::sidetable_release(bool, bool) + 292
        sp = 0x000000016fdfce50
        pc = 0x000000019d9e5c34  libobjc.A.dylib`objc_msgSend + 52
      cpsr = 0x20001000
tipa commented 1 day ago

I'm also seeing this crash in my app:

EXC_BAD_ACCESS
cancel > class > isEqual: >
KERN_INVALID_ADDRESS at 0x15326c8b184f08.

0   libobjc.A.dylib                 0x31e64bc20         objc_msgSend
1   MyApp12                         0x2048c8bf4         xamarin_get_frame_length (trampolines.m:570)
2   MyApp12                         0x2048cfe50         xamarin_dyn_objc_msgSend
3   MyApp12                         0x204ca0560         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Messaging__CallVariadicFunction (Messaging.cs:164)
4   MyApp12                         0x204c3cd24         _Microsoft_iOS_Foundation_NSUrlSessionTask__Cancel (NSUrlSessionTask.g.cs:156)
5   MyApp12                         0x204c4b15c         _Microsoft_iOS_System_Net_Http_NSUrlSessionHandler__RemoveInflightData (NSUrlSessionHandler.cs:234)
6   MyApp12                         0x204c4f598         _Microsoft_iOS_System_Net_Http_NSUrlSessionHandler___c__DisplayClass58_0___SendAsync_b__0 (NSUrlSessionHandler.cs:543)
7   MyApp12                         0x204e1f380         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
8   MyApp12                         0x204e1fa08         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
9   MyApp12                         0x204e1eff8         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
10  MyApp12                         0x204e27c08         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
11  MyApp12                         0x204e26c68         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
12  MyApp12                         0x204e262b4         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
13  MyApp12                         0x204e25f84         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
14  MyApp12                         0x204ea97ec         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
15  MyApp12                         0x204e1d1ac         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
16  MyApp12                         0x204e1d71c         _Microsoft_iOS_ObjCRuntime_Trampolines_NIDUIDeferredMenuElementCompletionHandler__Invoke (Trampolines.g.cs:51484)
17  libsystem_pthread.dylib         0x432744378         _pthread_start

If this should be tracked as a separate issue, I can open one

rolfbjarne commented 22 hours ago

@tipa yes, please file a new issue, that looks like something different.