PCB orders and status

[eabase]

I would love to order a PCB with all the components already included and placed.

1. What is the current design status of PCB?
2. From where can we order these PCB's?
3. Can they get both made and populated?

[justLV]

Pending any hardware optimizations (as mentioned in other issue you opened), I'll open the Crowd Supply campaign. They'll take care of all fulfillment and buy up inventory so that I can just place a batch order, making it simple to order from them.

[DanielHabenicht]

Hey @eabase, sorry for hijacking the thread. I'd also like to try out the PCB but PCBWay only lets me order 5 at a time. If you or anybody else is interested and geographically near (Germany). I can purchase 5 and distribute them. That would be 17,39$ per Unit + Shipping

[jwhengeveld]

Hey @eabase, sorry for hijacking the thread. I'd also like to try out the PCB but PCBWay only lets me order 5 at a time. If you or anybody else is interested and geographically near (Germany). I can purchase 5 and distribute them. That would be 17,39$ per Unit + Shipping

Hi! Count me in (Netherlands), I would like to buy 1 or 2 pieces

[davenewham]

@DanielHabenicht does that include component cost? I think that might be additional...

Even so, I wouldn't mind taking a couple from you

[DanielHabenicht]

@DanielHabenicht does that include component cost? I think that might be additional...

Ahh, yes! I did not notice the 0 for Component costs. I added them to my cart now so they will be reviewed and component cost will be added. I will update this thread then.

[DanielHabenicht]

I've got the final price:

181$ for 5 ≈ 36$ If you are still interested just write back.

[davenewham]

@DanielHabenicht sure, but that still seems like pre tax and shipping so I expect it to cost even more!

In that case, I would only really be interested in one PCB for the time being (if that's OK)

[jwhengeveld]

Yes! I would like one piece!

[DanielHabenicht]

Alright, if there is one more who wants a piece more I will order.

[Uriziel01]

@DanielHabenicht I would like to buy one, I'm located in Poland. Did you used the latest revision avilable (it was updated 9 days ago)?

[Uriziel01]

I've also tried exporting the BOM and pick&place files to try JLCPCB and the cost seems a little bit better at around $120 but currently they don't have the MEMS and I had to replace one of the inductors with a slightly higher capacitance one + crystal oscillator is not exactly the same, probably not the best idea to experiment when this will be the first iteration and if something is wrong I'll have nothing to compare any measurements against 😉 Maybe it's a interesting concept for the future, PCB quality (especially silk screen) if slightly worse in JLCPCB but the price is almost always better for simple PCBs.

[justLV]

Feel free to, only thing I'd caution is to make sure JLC gets the part placement correct & the correct parts, sometimes their library parts are really badly named. Had issues where they put on incorrect components, and didn't follow the specified rotation of U1 even after manually confirming which was painful to rework.

The MEMS mics are probably the most expensive part at $5 per PCB so that's probably some of the difference

[Uriziel01]

@DanielHabenicht I've just got back my final price from PCBWAY and it's almost $200 😁 So I'll definitely take 1 from your order please. Just let me know how to pay you and whats the price for shipping from DE -> PL

[DanielHabenicht]

Sorry, I did not have time in the last few days. If anybody is more knowledgeable about all of this I am happy for somebody else to order. It's the first time for me and I literally just clicked on the order link on the shared project from this repository: https://www.pcbway.com/project/shareproject/Onju_Voice_d33625a1.html (which should be from the release 9 days ago)

I've just seen they also changed the Crystal oscillator on my order. I uploaded the xlsx so you can have a look. T-1E4W641674A-5sets-onju-voice-bom(2023-10-11).xls

[Uriziel01]

I sadly don't have time to handle this and then also handle shipping all the boards to all of your guys, so please feel free to make an order in pcbway and I'm more than happy to pay your. Thank you.

[DanielHabenicht]

Sure, I am happy to order and distribute it to you. I just want to be sure to order something that works. So, is the change of the crystal oscillator ok?

[Uriziel01]

Nice, they replaced it with 12uF one, even when seiko epson does produce identical 10uF variants (Q22FA12800101) or even ABRACON with lower/higher ±ppm but not one with different spec, have no idea how load capacitance affects freqency and/or frequency stability, but I would rather not thest this on my own first batch PCB, just to be on the safe side.

@justLV You've designed it, you're the expert here, help 😄

EDIT: Looking at ESP32 spec they do in fact insist on the 10uF, 10ppm crystal.

[don86nl]

Sure, I am happy to order and distribute it to you. I just want to be sure to order something that works. So, is the change of the crystal oscillator ok?

Hi @DanielHabenicht , do you happen to have one more spare to share? :-)

[DanielHabenicht]

Sure, I am happy to order and distribute it to you. I just want to be sure to order something that works. So, is the change of the crystal oscillator ok?

Hi @DanielHabenicht , do you happen to have one more spare to share? :-)

You can surely have one, but I haven't ordered yet. I don't know wheter the substitution of the one component would be working, so until I can confirm it working or get the right part I won't order.

[don86nl]

Sure, I am happy to order and distribute it to you. I just want to be sure to order something that works. So, is the change of the crystal oscillator ok?

Hi @DanielHabenicht , do you happen to have one more spare to share? :-)

You can surely have one, but I haven't ordered yet. I don't know wheter the substitution of the one component would be working, so until I can confirm it working or get the right part I won't order.

Ah, I was hoping you wouldve gotten an answer by now. If you do find the answer and order a batch, I'd like to get one off you.

[TheZoker]

I'm also very interested and I live near Munich 👍

[ezerez]

I just got a quote back from PCBWay and they dont seem to have changed anything on the BOM. Do you have to check the components one by one if there was a change or do they remark when they dont have something in stock? Duty pre paid to Germany would be 244 USD for 5.

[pl0ink]

I suggest you all wait a moment before ordering the PCB's. I just received my order from PCBWay and there seems to be a problem with the PSRAM. I have tested 3 boards, all have the same issue: Memory allocation failed! Will investigate further in the weekend.

Well turned out to be user error. I used an other board as devboard before and it uses a a different PSRAM mode. After setting it to the correct PSRAM mode it works, and audio replay works. Mic not working yet, probably screwed something up with pin def. Will update.

Well, my mistake again. To make the Mic work you need to attach the small ribbon cable connecting the Mute button and power connector. Without this connection the ESP board is on constant mute. But because this ribbon cable and the connectors are very fragile and you can not access the USB connector when the Nest mini is fully assembled, you might want to develop and test with only the USB cable and speaker attached. To temporary ignore / disable the mute function just comment out this line: // pinMode(MUTE, INPUT_PULLUP);

Anyway, the boards I got from PCBWay appear to work well, build quality is very good.
I'm happy with them, sorry for the confusion. :-)

[qnlbnsl]

Anyone wanting to group buy in US? I want to get a few of these as well.

[bedbug1226]

Would be nice if someone just ordered a butt load and sold them on etsy or something.

[LordNex]

I just put in an order or I’d join you. Waiting for the review to finish. If you don’t go gold. You can get them down a little cheaper Benjamin T Powers

On Nov 5, 2023, at 10:05 PM, bedbug1226 @.***> wrote:



Would be nice if someone just ordered a butt load and sold them on etsy or something.

— Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHubhttps://github.com/justLV/onju-voice/issues/8#issuecomment-1794051498, or unsubscribehttps://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ACGXNJE3P5FNK74N525N5M3YDBHYFAVCNFSM6AAAAAA34K6S4SVHI2DSMVQWIX3LMV43OSLTON2WKQ3PNVWWK3TUHMYTOOJUGA2TCNBZHA. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to this thread.Message ID: @.***>

[dpetrillo740]

I'm also interested and in the US.

[LordNex]

Was looking at 5 myself. But the initial build plus components was like +$150USD. It may be smarter for us to group together and import and resell these

Of course we still need a source for containerization of both the firmware and case design but we would just need to find a source. Obviously giving a good % back to @ justLV. I don't have an 3D printer yet or we could LiDAR the basic design and thing-a-ma or PCBWay the plastics. I have 4 I need to replace. I'd love to do my Lenovo Google Display somehow.

Benjamin T Powers

On Nov 7, 2023, at 7:10 PM, Dave Petrillo @.***> wrote:



I'm also interested and in the US.

[LordNex]

Sorry, email replies look like shit on here.

[DanielHabenicht]

I just got a quote back from PCBWay and they dont seem to have changed anything on the BOM. Do you have to check the components one by one if there was a change or do they remark when they dont have something in stock? Duty pre paid to Germany would be 244 USD for 5.

You have to look into the BOM Excel they provide (under "Quoted BOM" Button). It is not displayed in the UI if they change something. If there are no entries in the "Actual Purchase Mfg Part#" Column then they used exactly the specified components. That's at least what I hope (I have no experience with ordering these).

If we are getting more and more people it should probably get cheaper...

Here's a table of all requests, feel free to edit or add yourself: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12665xjQDnMFgY-_ZgX68pbzb8GG_iQU4DQ2IfGRLkJY/edit?usp=sharing

[ezerez]

I just got a quote back from PCBWay and they dont seem to have changed anything on the BOM. Do you have to check the components one by one if there was a change or do they remark when they dont have something in stock? Duty pre paid to Germany would be 244 USD for 5.

You have to look into the BOM Excel they provide (under "Quoted BOM" Button). It is not displayed in the UI if they change something. If there are no entries in the "Actual Purchase Mfg Part#" Column then they used exactly the specified components. That's at least what I hope (I have no experience with ordering these).

If we are getting more and more people it should probably get cheaper...

Yes I checked the excel and everything was added. I repeated the order now for 10 pieces (I would probably also want 2) and it is under review. I will let you guys know if they have enough stock and what the price is.

Also tried to make the order on jlcpcb, but they did not have the microphones and esps in stock + some other small parts.

[MarcusAlbon]

@DanielHabenicht I follow, I would like two (Europe)

[LordNex]

I just got a quote back from PCBWay and they dont seem to have changed anything on the BOM. Do you have to check the components one by one if there was a change or do they remark when they dont have something in stock? Duty pre paid to Germany would be 244 USD for 5.

You have to look into the BOM Excel they provide (under "Quoted BOM" Button). It is not displayed in the UI if they change something. If there are no entries in the "Actual Purchase Mfg Part#" Column then they used exactly the specified components. That's at least what I hope (I have no experience with ordering these).

If we are getting more and more people it should probably get cheaper...

Yes I checked the excel and everything was added. I repeated the order now for 10 pieces (I would probably also want 2) and it is under review. I will let you guys know if they have enough stock and what the price is.

Also tried to make the order on jlcpcb, but they did not have the microphones and esps in stock + some other small parts.

I'd buy 5 here in the US. I'd just like to see them under $30 a completed board or you might as well buy a Muse Lux

[DanielHabenicht]

Yes I checked the excel and everything was added. I repeated the order now for 10 pieces (I would probably also want 2) and it is under review. I will let you guys know if they have enough stock and what the price is.

Great! I also updated mine to 10. So lets see who gets feedback from pcbway first :D Probably they now source some parts, because so many people put them in their shopping carts^

[bedbug1226]

I was wanting to grab about 5 myself.

[DanielHabenicht]

PCBWay wrote back to me that the crystal is out of stock everywhere so they cant give a quote. :(

[ezerez]

PCBWay wrote back to me that the crystal is out of stock everywhere so they cant give a quote. :(

Very strange, I also got a quote back and there was again no issue on the BOM it seems. Unfortunately the price is higher per piece then my 5 piece order. It seems to be very random what they do with the quotes ... I am thinking of ordering the 5 piece quote. Unfortunately with the import tax it is not cheap, it would come to 228 euro so 45,6 euro + sending from Germany to someone. Is there any interest for this, because 5 boards will be a little too much for me 😄

[PlanetSmasher]

I got a quote aswell and it sums up to 150$ for 5 pieces. (Germany, Bavaria :P aswell)

As 30 $ a piece it is slightly too much for me, as I have to buy a nest device aswell. so for my terms it might be cheaper to go and grab RaspiAudio MUSE Luxe

I went for the HASL Lead Free finish as it might get a few $$ cheaper

Here is the Quote, no issues with BOM

[ezerez]

I got a quote aswell and it sums up to 150$ for 5 pieces. (Germany, Bavaria :P aswell)

As 30 $ a piece it is slightly too much for me, as I have to buy a nest device aswell. so for my terms it might be cheaper to go and grab RaspiAudio MUSE Luxe

I went for the HASL Lead Free finish as it might get a few $$ cheaper

Here is the Quote, no issues with BOM

Ah yes, I see your pcbs itself are a little cheaper. The added cost is when you choose the prepaid customs option in the next step. If you do not do that you will get taxed when it arrives in Europe and that will usually be more expensive. So it will be more then 150usd in the end. For me the 45 euro would be fine, a google nest is around 20 euro and I dont mind paying more for the much nicer form factor. But yeah 5 pieces are a little too much for me 😅

[Uriziel01]

While you discuss here I just wanted to remind about the post @DanielHabenicht prepared here https://github.com/justLV/onju-voice/issues/8#issuecomment-1802859463. We already have people willing to buy around 20 boards worldwide, so you don't have to get (and pay) for all 5 by yourself. We just now need someone who want to spend some time and effect to reship the board afterward.

[don86nl]

PCBWay wrote back to me that the crystal is out of stock everywhere so they cant give a quote. :(

Very strange, I also got a quote back and there was again no issue on the BOM it seems. Unfortunately the price is higher per piece then my 5 piece order. It seems to be very random what they do with the quotes ... I am thinking of ordering the 5 piece quote. Unfortunately with the import tax it is not cheap, it would come to 228 euro so 45,6 euro + sending from Germany to someone. Is there any interest for this, because 5 boards will be a little too much for me 😄

Yes, i'd still like 1 one of those. (I am located in the Netherlands)

[LordNex]

If we can get them at a decent price point. Over $30 a board you might as well just get a Muse LUX

Sent from Mailhttps://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986 for Windows

From: Paweł @.> Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2023 8:53 AM To: @.> Cc: @.>; @.> Subject: Re: [justLV/onju-voice] PCB orders and status (Issue #8)

While you discuss here I just wanted to remind about the post @DanielHabenichthttps://github.com/DanielHabenicht prepared here https://github.com/justLV/onju-voice/issues/8#issuecomment-1802859463<1802859463>. We already have people willing to buy around 20 boards worldwide, so you don't have to get (and pay) for all 5 by yourself. We just now need someone who want to spend some time and effect to reship the board afterward.

— Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHubhttps://github.com/justLV/onju-voice/issues/8#issuecomment-1810378081, or unsubscribehttps://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ACGXNJBJWOAOSVOCGVO4P53YEOAWBAVCNFSM6AAAAAA34K6S4SVHI2DSMVQWIX3LMV43OSLTON2WKQ3PNVWWK3TUHMYTQMJQGM3TQMBYGE. You are receiving this because you commented.Message ID: @.***>

[bobzer]

Hi, Can you advice us on the options that we should select or not ? I mean should we choose an edge connector ? if so what kind ? Also wondering for surface finish,? thank you

[bedbug1226]

If we can get them at a decent price point. Over $30 a board you might as well just get a Muse LUX Sent from Mail<go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows From: Paweł @.> Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2023 8:53 AM To: @.> Cc: @.>; @.> Subject: Re: [justLV/onju-voice] PCB orders and status (Issue #8) While you discuss here I just wanted to remind about the post @DanielHabenicht[@DanielHabenicht](https://github.com/DanielHabenicht) prepared here #8 (comment)<1802859463>. We already have people willing to buy around 20 boards worldwide, so you don't have to get (and pay) for all 5 by yourself. We just now need someone who want to spend some time and effect to reship the board afterward. — Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub<#8 (comment)>, or unsubscribe<github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ACGXNJBJWOAOSVOCGVO4P53YEOAWBAVCNFSM6AAAAAA34K6S4SVHI2DSMVQWIX3LMV43OSLTON2WKQ3PNVWWK3TUHMYTQMJQGM3TQMBYGE>. You are receiving this because you commented.Message ID: @.***>

Most people are probably here trying to get this because the Muse LUXE is not really nice looking compared to the Nest mini and the Nest mini 2nds gen also has more accessories support. Example I have multiple nest minis just hanging off a power plug using a cheap wall mount. The Muse LUXE is way too bulky for that and it would look bad just hanging off the wall.

[ezerez]

So I got a final update from PCBWay. When I changed to the cheaper surface finish, I got again a more expensive assembly cost with 88 usd in stead of 30 usd and when I asked PCBWay about it, it seems the 30 usd assembly is only a one time offer. So after I deleted the order with the 30 usd assembly in my cart they adjusted it and now I have an order ready with cheaper surface finish and 30 USD Assembly. It would be 172.84 USD with VAT included for 5 boards. Europe also adds extra import costs when the order is above 150 euro, so it would actually be more expensive to order 10 or more boards.

So in short I think this is the cheapest way of getting the boards in Europe at the moment. The pcbs itself are only around 5usd and all the rest of the cost scales linearly if you increase the quantity.

I have attached the BOM, because it seems they have changed 1 part in my order now. If someone can confirm that this part is OK that would be very nice. It seems to have the same specifications but I am by no means an electronics expert.

@Uriziel01 Yes, I am well aware of this and I also do not mind sending out some boards around Europe. But it seems to some people also the price is important, which I understand. That is why I was asking for an extra confirmation.

T-1E11W623223A-5sets-onju-voice-bom-2023.11.15.xlsx

[Uriziel01]

@ezerez This is the exact crystal oscillator replacement they did for @DanielHabenicht the difference is the load capacitance is slightly higher (12pF vs 10pF), I have no experience to say if this will cause any kind of troubles, maybe it will work just fine and maybe clock stability will be compromised. That said I've checked some other design (https://github.com/jcalvinowens/tempsensor) and they've used the exact chip manufacturer proposed for us (Q22FA12800332) and it's working while using 15pF XTAL caps, onju voice design uses 16pF ones, plus the PCB is larger so more stray capacitance there, I THINK this should compensate enough to be able to safely use 12pF one without any changes but I don't have the knowledge to give you a definite 100% verified answer.

I know it is not up to me to decide about anything but I think we should give it a shot. Any thoughts on this?

[Uriziel01]

If anyone else wants to figure this out on his own: https://blog.adafruit.com/2012/01/24/choosing-the-right-crystal-and-caps-for-your-design/

~~I figured out if crystal is 12pF and we use 16pF caps we get: (of course i've pulled the 3pF stray capacitance straight from my ass, it's just a wild guess based on other designs I've found on the internet)~~

(16 pF * 16 pF)/(16 pF + 16 pF) + 3 pF= 11 pF

[ezerez]

@Uriziel01 the original part proposed is ABM11-40.000MHZ-12-B1U-T3 which is also 12pF capacitance or am I looking at the BOM wrong?

[Uriziel01]

Eeeee, what the... was I looking at the wrong BOM or what? 😄 I could swear when I've checked it some weeks ago it was 10pF! In that case, please disregard what I've said above, this substitution is fine 👍

[rosscullen]

Willing to buy 2 boards from someone if they want to PM me please (Europe). Thanks 😊