search

leezer3 / OpenBVE

OpenBVE- A free train simulator
http://www.openbve-project.net
275 stars 52 forks source link

accessibility for the visually impaired of open BVE #639

Open marrie opened 3 years ago

marrie commented 3 years ago

Description

I am a visually impaired user of open BVE. I and others who use this want to see a bit more accessibility of the app such as speed reading and ways to get to the station. trhe program is 90 percent there as I can use it, but I would love to see better intagration with my screen reader

Reproduction

If the issue occurs in multiple routes/ trains, please provide one or two samples. In order to reproduce the issue and debug it, it's helpful to have the following:

Route

Please provide a link to where the route may be downloaded.

Train

Please provide a link to the train may be downloaded.

Logs

Logs may be accessed through the 'Report Problem' button on the bottom left of the screen. Please provide a log, and a crash-log if the game actually crashes.

Related information

I would like to start a dialogue with you guys on accessibility as the sim is almost there, and since this is open source, I'd be willing to test (not compile) builds for you guys. openBVE Bug Report24_05_2021.zip

leezer3 commented 3 years ago

Fixed. (was reading the value in m/s as opposed to km/h)

I've now dropped all this into the main auto-generated nightly builds, as it seems reasonably OK. Still need a few little tweaks, but I think we're mostly there.

https://vps.bvecornwall.co.uk/OpenBVE/Builds/OpenBVE-2021-06-07.zip

I've also added the following page to the main site: https://openbve-project.net/play-accessibility/

marrie commented 3 years ago

Cool. Thank you so much. I will test this in the morning. I already got confirmation it works, but I do still want to try it to verify and maybe I might or might not have any ideas. I will grab the night we build tomorrow morning if that makes sense. LOL.

marrie commented 3 years ago

I was going to edit, but decided against doing the whole 45 minute rout. Besides I'm half asleep.

Here is the think out loud for this. I hope I didn't miss anything I summarized here.

Thanks so much.

jessieppp commented 3 years ago

should we be getting the nightly builds now or do we still stay with theese to fix the beeping issue with the loud beep?

jessieppp commented 3 years ago

when i hit the control shift a for signal i get how far to the signal but don't get weather it is a stop or what the signal is. will that be fixed?

marrie commented 3 years ago

Right. I can also reproduce this. I can’t exactly read the phrase, something like “aspect M.” I forgot to point tah tout in my last few comments.

Thanks so much.

leezer3 commented 3 years ago

Ah.

That's a slight issue.

TLDR: A signal in OpenBVE can have any arbitrary set of numerical aspects. The current thing reads the numerical aspect, which obviously isn't good enough.

A common convention is to use 0 as the stop aspect & for other aspects to go up in multiples of 2, but that's by no means a given. A signal aspect can also have a speed limit attached to it, although that's less common.

Might have to try and get funny somehow, although I haven't got a decent idea yet :/

jessieppp commented 3 years ago

ok cool should we just download the daily builds as they are built? or just play with the screen reader test builds.

leezer3 commented 3 years ago

Either.

I'll let you know when something of interest to you lot gets changed.

pitermach commented 3 years ago

Hello, First of all thanks for implementing this. I messed with BVE years ago (back when BVE4 was the latest) just to hear the sounds, but being able to actually play the game is kind of amazing.

If I repeat anything that's a known issue, I appologise - I didn't have time to watch all of the videos people have recorded. I see that people have already mentioned the signal announcement is just saying "with the aspect aspect" and the next station key doesn't give the name.

The stopping overlay sound is incredibly loud, to the point I can totally see people getting tinitis from it. I really think the volume should be lowered considerably or the sound be changed all together. I have thought of 2 ideas that I think could help:

marrie commented 3 years ago

For me I don’t like the pitch as my ears were way too sensitive. So we did the volume thing. I do like the idea of the short beeps like in DT,

I am aware we cannot please all because of hearing, other disabilities etc. We could do the beeps idea though like in your second idea I believe that one, that is, if the code would allow it. I am not a coder, at all. I’m just one who wants to see this thing become as accessible as it can be.

Thanks.

celtichawk commented 2 years ago

I'm going to give this a nudge since I know what I need from the Linux side of things.

I don't know of a good cross platform library unfortunately, Linux uses speech-dispatcher for sending speech output and braille is handled by a seperate system

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't OpenBVE now have built in accessibility keys or am I wrong on that? I thought somewhere it did.

Personally, all I'd need would be a way to set up the accessibility hotkeys and a list of what's on the screen menu wise. I dont know if Tolc can interface with speech-dispatcher however, but I feel like if OBVE has built in accessibility features there's no need to make your own, and instead use existing features that OpenBVE ships with.

My main hurdle right now is the menu. Running Solus (on one of my boxes) and the latest release as a .zip, using mono OpenBVE.exe gets me nothing in terms of speech output in the menus however.

So I'd say that's point one.

I'm not asking for the way menus are to be fully redone, no. That'd be too much work. It's more a listing of what's on the menu when you start it up, for example a way to quickly pick a train and get driving. That sort of thing.

For example, there's a project to document the menus of videogames that don't speak out of the box, so would it be possible to consider a menu listing of each menu and what it contains?

Point two (and this is the one i'm unsure on), is the one I mentioned above. Does OpenBVE contain acessibility features built in? I thought I read that somewhere.

Point three, Did you get anywhere finding a way to make Tolc work with Linux/Mac screenreaders, Orca and Voiceover respectively?

apfingstl commented 1 year ago

I just used version 1.8.4.2 (Sepember 2022) and so far it works great with screen reader. What would be very helpful is some kind of monitor display, where I can see my speed distance to the next station. Currently I have to press the key strokes all the time. Also pressing ctrl+shift+a is not showing the status of the next signal, it is showing next signal in xxx meter with apsect aspcectm. Would be great if this could be fixed.

marrie commented 1 year ago

Actually, I go on sound alone as I’m familiar with that particular train. I did not suggest a display, as I would not want a spam of messages, so this is the best we could produce at the time. I still think it is, hit the key every once in a while, not all the time.

apfingstl commented 1 year ago

I think using a Braille display may have some different use cases here. But still I get no information about the status of the signals, as I said, pressing ctrl+shift+a is not showing me the status. Also the station name is not shown when pressing ctrl+shift+t. The sound indicating that I need to stop is hard to tell where exactly I need to stop. I would also think beep sounds getting faster the sooner we get to the ideal point would help a lot.

marrie commented 1 year ago

What I do is I switch to the outside view the slow down. The sound will get louder the closer you get.

apfingstl commented 1 year ago

Thanks, I will try this. Did you ever get the TGV trains to move? Also what are you doing with the signals? I never get a state of the signal so I sometimes overrun a red one.

marrie commented 1 year ago

I can get them to work, I really am not sure how, perhaps I pay attention to the speech and slow down when needed, It’s actually been a while since I do play, I do hope accessibility can be improved as ther seems to be renewed interest in the simulator.

Thanks.

apfingstl commented 1 year ago

Hi,

Yes it is a great simulator.

I would say the following things should be changed:

This would make things easier.

Am 01.11.2022 um 23:16 schrieb Sarah Alawami:

I can get them to work, I really am not sure how, perhaps I pay attention to the speech and slow down when needed, It’s actually been a while since I do play, I do hope accessibility can be improved as ther seems to be renewed interest in the simulator.

Thanks.

— Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/leezer3/OpenBVE/issues/639#issuecomment-1299299399, or unsubscribe https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AAB2PK52Z5VUCTM6VQ2VIZLWGGJFTANCNFSM45NXBNCQ. You are receiving this because you commented.Message ID: @.***>