So, what's next?

[zloirock]

https://github.com/zloirock/core-js/blob/master/docs/2023-02-14-so-whats-next.md

Politics = ban.

[igoradamenko]

Hey, Denis!

Just wanted to ask, which platform is taking less fee for donations? Patreon or OpenCollective? If I can pick either of them, which one will be more profitable for you?

[zloirock]

Hi Igor! In both cases commission is significant. IIRC via Patreon, it's a little less. However, there are some reasons why now I'd prefer Open Collective. Anyway, both options are good.

[PeerRich]

hey @zloirock heartbreaking story. I feel you. I run a commercial open source company over at https://github.com/calcom/cal.com and have shared your post with colleagues of mine who might be hiring.

maybe even vercel.com? could be a great fit

[Voltra]

You're literally the embodiment of that XKCD and we didn't even know... Thank you for all your hard work on core-js, you've carried the whole modern Era of the web on your back this whole time. I'll do my best to share this around in hopes that people will read it and re-share it until opportunities arise. Will definitely want to support monthly to the best of my abilities. In hopes I can get a budget at work to support crucial FOSS like core-js

[shellscape]

Set it adrift. Focus on family. The community at large will pick it up and maintain it. Your legacy is intact. Such is FOSS.

https://liberamanifesto.com/

[pthrasher]

Patreon sub added. Thanks for all the hard work! No doubt you've saved me many thousands of hours over the years!

[EnderNon]

dude, i had no idea. been using this quite a lot for the past while now! open collective or bitcoin better for you?

[DimosthenisK]

The hate you got for this was really unjustified.

[Revilotom]

When I hear stories like this "Never was so much owed by so many to so few" always springs to mind

[HighwayofLife]

Thanks for taking such an extraordinary amount of time to write that up and explain everything. I had no idea, and I genuinely feel bad for you, especially since you're also a victim and collateral damage of the Ukraine conflict which makes supporting you unnecessarily more difficult than it already was. I found this link from kind souls who shared it on Reddit. I'll be sharing this across our company to see if something can be done.

[JoaaoVerona]

What you built with core-js is amazing. Hope everything gets better for you. ❤️

[stepancar]

@zloirock, thank you for all your work on this project. Really heartbreaking story. I always knew core-js is a complex project and result is used by the whole community, but I couldn't imagine nobody pay for that. I wish you'll get nice job with decent pay! For now I can only support you with couple coffee cups a month. Subscribed on open collective

[stephenjayakar]

Thank you for writing this up and espousing your values. I think they're great, but yeah, like family & surviving is first, right?

[stephenjayakar]

Saving the "well-paid engineers'" time should be lower priority?

[Strangemother]

Your post is a great read thank you for taking your time out to write it.

I see a lot of projects with multiple licensing; one for open source, and another for commercial.

Given you have evidence (extremely) large companies are using your product, could you add tiered license structure? core-js is free until you earn $1M per year - then it's $200 per month flat?

---

The businesses your project lives within are mandated by software laws and your project exists because the task is hard. Fundamentally most people are using your project because they don't have the time or ability to do it themselves.

Large corps such as a international shop know this - and it's cheaper to pay ~$2k rather than employ someone. As software licenses are bound to the product cost (where FOSS contributions are primarily optional) big companies have the option to pay ahead on their internal budgeting.

---

It's evident you've paid forward (for many years) to those earning from you - It's fair to ask for like 0.002% in return. If a company/entity who can afford it, will not pay - and you're struggling to exist to support them - then it's up to them to repair that problem.

---

I understand easy for me to sit on my soap-box and yell foul, however it doesn't feel right that your product is used by large corporations, and you're barely surviving - when there are other lesser critical tools of which demand much more.

[zekefeu]

That's fucked up. The kind of hate you received is insane, that's actually heartbreaking. It sucks to live in a world with that kind of self-entitled morons.

I really hope you'll get more recognition and donations after this post, and even if I've never used core-js directly myself, thanks for making the web a better place.

[slezica]

@zloirock Hey man. I'm sorry you had to go through of all that. Thank you for sharing your story. It was eye-opening.

I'm sending $100 your way.

I've never donated that much in one go -- but maybe I should start doing so. I have paid more for less useful things than core-js. Your work has made mine faster, and I got paid for it. I will start paying more attention to how the projects I use are maintained.

[OzairP]

The FOSS community needs to find a solution for the kinds of people and projects like this. I’m sorry you went through so much and received so much hate.

[bglamadrid]

never knew core-js was so relevant for most of my own work (in and out of office work), yet I've seen it lying around more than once.

I'm grateful for your dedication and I'll be monthly backing you with what I can over OpenCollective.

[Danack]

It's not great that github sponsors isn't available for you. But for other open source devs who are able to use it, imo they should stop with the 'if you can chip in with a dollar' words. Instead, ask for decent amounts of money; you only need a few large sponsors to make a big difference - here are the words I use: https://gist.github.com/Danack/f99f417a43fc8258babc26704b28f72f

And this is the type of project that AWS should be sponsoring imo. Maybe people could chime in, respectfully of course, here: https://twitter.com/MrDanack/status/1625278550667587584 ?

[zekefeu]

The FOSS community needs to find a solution for the kinds of people and projects like this. I’m sorry you went through so much and received so much hate.

There are solutions, but for "bigger" software than this; the RHEL subscription model, the open core model, etc. idk how it would apply to core-js though.

[merlox]

You have to be compensated. I'm thankful for you sharing your story which is super illuminating to people that don't know what's going on behind the scenes. Many many great projects are open source and they are the fundamentals of modern web development. I suggest to create a common fund and support projects that clearly deserve it. Actual grants by people using it.

[warrior-dev]

I want to express my sincere gratitude for the tireless and dedicated work you have done in the field of open source. Your project is a true testament to your passion and commitment to improving people's lives through technology.

Unfortunately, it is a shame that you have not received proper financial support to continue your work. I hope you soon find the necessary funding to continue improving and developing your project.

Furthermore, I would like to suggest that you share your progress on platforms such as Twitter. This way, the developer community can see what you are doing and support your efforts. I also apologize on behalf of all other developers. It is not that they do not want to help, I believe many of them simply take for granted that the project is being maintained and are not aware of the importance of your work.

Asking for help openly and sharing your roadmap with the community would be the best option to receive the necessary support to continue your efforts. I am sure that many developers would be willing to help if they knew how they could do so.

And please ignore any negative comments, those kind of people just need to be reformed in some way.

[bartekpacia]

The story was eye-opening and heartbreaking. I admire your resilience in developing core-js. I sent some money.

All these big-co's bragging about how they support open-source and whatnot, yet it's all mostly smoke screen. In the end, all that matters for them is profit. The behavior of TC39 members is also just... pathetic.

I wish you all the best. Pay off debt, leave Russia with your family, and safely get to the civilized world.

[pimhakkert]

Thank you, seriously. core-js is the backbone of the modern web, and can directly be linked to millions of dollars in cost savings. I will make a donation to you.

I hope your family is okay, it must be hard for them to see their husband and father be abused in this manner.

[merlox]

It's not great that github sponsors isn't available for you. But for other open source devs who are able to use it, imo they should stop with the 'if you can chip in with a dollar' words. Instead, ask for decent amounts of money; you only need a few large sponsors to make a big difference - here are the words I use: https://gist.github.com/Danack/f99f417a43fc8258babc26704b28f72f

And this is the type of project that AWS should be sponsoring imo. Maybe people could chime in, respectfully of course, here: https://twitter.com/MrDanack/status/1625278550667587584 ?

This is great I suggest OP to use this model so that big companies see the value. Meaning paying monthly = higher priority to their requests. Plus a premium model where you personally help companies save that extra few seconds that are worth billions to companies like Amazon. You have such knowledge and experience to make it happen.

Sometimes it's enough to show how little changes can make big impacts like your story.

[noah79]

You are a hero. An underpaid, shit upon, taken for granted hero, but you wear a cape nonetheless and your tireless (and unpaid) work has enabled millions of us to better build applications that help us feed our families and make our customers happy. Thank you for all that you do. I'll talk to my CTO about making a donation as we're already a supporter for a few projects on github that we use. Thanks for taking the time to write up this comprehensive post sharing how the sausage gets made and a big 'fuck you' to all the people shitting on your work or you having the gall to ask to not be impoverished for this thankless work that you do. You're an excellent developer and I hope you are rewarded richly for your work as you deserve to be.

[TibixDev]

The amount of hate you received, while working so tirelessly and for so little money is just horrible. I want to thank you the insurmountable amount of work you have done for us all, so we can all build better apps with less to worry about.

I'll try making a donation and I encourage everyone else to do so. Spread the word!

[Pharmasolin]

I think you need to get help from a therapist, you don't owe anything to the world. Archive this rep, go find proper 8 to 5 job (remote so you don't even need to work really) and have a great life.

[BoberMod]

Do companies like @opencollective or @patreon use your polyfill and maybe they can turn off commission on your accounts, at least temporarily?

https://github.com/opencollective https://github.com/Patreon

[TibixDev]

Do companies like @opencollective or @Patreon use your polyfill and maybe they can turn off commission on your accounts, at least temporarily?

https://github.com/opencollective https://github.com/Patreon

Yep, Patreon uses it. If anyone, this guy absolutely deserves it. The creativity, and the whole Patreon website is powered by this library, not just by "membership".

[zloirock]

@EnderNon between Open Collective and BTC I'd prefer BTC because of the lack of commission.

[zloirock]

@shellscape

The community at large will pick it up and maintain it.

I used to think the same. Then I became disillusioned with this.

[zloirock]

@rpadovani I didn't know about him, but someone already wrote me about him today. I'll take a look, thanks -)

[Tash-Feneko]

Do companies like @opencollective or @Patreon use your polyfill and maybe they can turn off commission on your accounts, at least temporarily? https://github.com/opencollective https://github.com/Patreon

Yep, Patreon uses it. If anyone, this guy absolutely deserves it. The creativity, and the whole Patreon website is powered by this library, not just by "membership".

Time to put pressure on the companies using core-js to support it. Let's start with Patreon: https://twitter.com/TashFeneko/status/1625294257731805190

[magdicom]

Thank you for all the hard work and time you've given, and I hope everything gets better for you and your family. ❤️

[RodTGG]

@zloirock This wont mean much coming from a nobody. But thank you for everything, you are truly an inspiration. The hate you've received is honestly disgusting and unjustified. Gonna admit i never knew anything about core-js before this. And am appalled at how the community has received your pleas for help and donations.

I don't have much to give sadly, but hoping any little bit helps here.

Wish you and your family all the best, hope you find a place worth your amazing talent.

[XSIRIX]

Hey @zloirock,

i just read your story today and i was kinda disappointed how unfair life sometimes is. I’m super melancholic and emotional lol.

I would really like to offer you help with corejs but I’m a junior engineer and have just too much going on in life.

Also, I’d really like to get in touch with you for a job. We are actually looking for Frontend engineers. We a are medium sized, remote first company (about 300 employees after a merge) located in Germany / Finland / Remote all over the world. The only issue is, you’re located in Russia and because of the political situation, idk if that’s possible. In our company, recommendations are almost everything so I could definitely get you in touch with one of the leads. Let me just tell you in advance, they would be happy to hear your story as much as I was happy reading about it just now.

If you know a way, where maybe you can relocate to Europe or at least anywhere in the world besides Russia, I’m sure I can do something for you. But the only thing blocking all this is Russia, man fuck the war..

Best wishes Siri

[komali2]

Thanks for all your hard work, I had no idea.

[olalonde]

Hi @zloirock , I'd be happy to maintain corejs if you want to give up or just need help.

[zloirock]

@olalonde you could start with helping with some issues - some of them marked as help wanted - and then we'll see -)

[breakerh]

I really would like to thank you for your work. I donated a very small amount of money because of costs this month. I will try to setup monthly donations next month.

You're too good for this world.. I've got 1 boy and 1 girl, family is important and I hope you can find the time to enjoy them.

Again, thank you and sorry that the 'community' let you down multiple times.

[bitplane]

Can't you just say you work for x$ an hour and patrons decide which things you work on? If there's no money for you to work, don't do the work. There's a difference between free software and free labour.

[KurtGokhan]

Life is unfair to those who just want to silently focus on the work they love. Yours was an eye-opening story. Whatever you decide, I wish you the best.

[zhuyifei1999]

Not a JS / front end dev but I feel you nevertheless. Thank you for everything you had done.

[Jason-Terry]

Burn. It. Down. #WeDontDeserveCoreJS

[neebs12]

Thank you so much for doing everything you did! I can't believe this was such a thankless job.

[janaroj]

thanks for all the hard work

[nopeless]

I appreciate what you are doing. I don't use this project (and I avoid transpilers in general), but I can see how your work is great. I wish things resolve in your favor ❤️

[luigimannoni]

Few points on the top of my mind in very disperse order, in no way I want to attack your work or project.

First and foremost: I have (unknowingly) introduced it in one big project and it's so deeply rooted into npm ecosystem that I tried to remove it from the project one time (just to test if we could do it without) with zero success but absolutely thank you for the time I saved into looking about creating or finding silly polyfills around the internet.

The fact that core-js comes along automatically with Babel and works totally transparently hurts a lot for your financial ask, I won't blame people who don't know they are using it. In fact I find it a quite twisted sick joke that Babel has a good solid funding and yet they donated only 5k to your project.

I wholeheartedly approve the idea of making it a commercial project or start restricting usage to companies with a revenue exceeding a certain threshold: a licensing method UnrealEngine alike if you want to pass my term and a business model that is fair for developers with personal projects.

On a closing note: I wasn't aware of other donating methods apart opencollective (which I am not heavily fond/sure of) and I am often reticent to contribute or do FOSS for a large part of my work day for the very same reasons you are struggling for: I can't pay rent or food with GitHub stars. Understanding the situation I'll start to donate a small token of appreciation monthly hoping other Devs like me join even for a stupid dollar or two, but I am sure hundreds of us will make surely the difference.

Hoping you'll take the right choice for your own sanity and wellbeing I wish all my best.